Patriots Pre-Game Thread

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J. Kapp 11
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:14 pm

PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:11 am
J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 8:54 am

You must not get to see the Vikings much in your part of the country (unlike the rest of us, who are forced to watch the Pats virtually every Sunday).

Mike Zimmer is among the best in the NFL at disguising blitzes. His team is experienced in his system and plays it well. At times, you'll see them put 9 men on the line of scrimmage and blitz nobody. Other times, nobody will show blitz, and then the slot corner or Harrison Smith will bust through. Other times, they'll mug the A-Gap, then blitz an outside corner from nowhere. But the truth is that the Vikings blitz very little. Our front four is so good and so deep that we don't have to, especially now that Everson Griffen is back and playing at a high level. Every man across the front can get pressure, which makes it impossible to simply double-team the star. Sheldon Richardson is one of the top pass-rushing tackles not named Aaron Donald, a maniac on stunts and twists. Danielle Hunter can be unstoppable off of either edge. Double him, and Griffen goes off. Brady is going to have to do his usual ... get rid of the ball quickly ... in order to avoid the rush. That helps keep big plays to a minimum.

As for coverage, we play plenty of man, but the truth is we play a lot of combo coverage. We have that flexibility because we rarely have fewer than 7 in coverage. If Xavier Rhodes is out, that hurts us. He would probably shadow Josh Gordon, who has burned the Vikings in the past (although that was under Leslie Frazier's defense, whom just about everybody burned).

Don't let the beginning of this season fool you. Yes, our defense was playing below par for the first month. But they're on a roll now. Held Drew Brees to 120 yards passing, Stafford to 199, Trubisky to 165, and Rodgers to 198. That's in the past four games. Our defense has played like what it was last year, the best in football. It's the offense that has let us down, with costly turnovers in the Saints and Bears game.

I do worry some about Cordarrelle Patterson. Belichick and McDaniels have found innovative ways to use him. He could be an X-factor for you guys. He's the guy on your roster who can take any play to the house. But I guarantee you, Zimmer knows this. He's talked about it all week.

You mention bracketing Diggs and single-covering Thielen. I hope you do that. Thielen will go off. He can't be covered one-on-one. I know Gilmore is good, but you don't know Adam Thielen. Nobody in football is better at the top of his route. He can shake press coverage, he always gets separation, and he catches anything near him. And at a solid 4.4, he's also faster than you think. So please ... single Adam Thielen. Or single Diggs if you want. That's the thing about Diggs and Thielen. No matter which one you double, the other is getting open. It's also why it hurts the Vikings when one of them is out. But when they both play, they produce. Shoot, even when we stunk against the Bears, they had 20 receptions.

The key for us will be to not beat ourselves with turnovers and stupid penalties, like Laquon Treadwell's idiotic unsportsmanlike penalty in a key moment of the Saints game. If we do that, we can beat the Patriots. You have great, great coaching. Your quarterback has seen it all and is still playing at a high level. But your roster talent doesn't come close to ours, and you'll see that Sunday. Plus, we're pretty well-coached, too. I think the line of New England -7 is ridiculous and doesn't give the Vikings enough respect. Perhaps their spotty play has earned that, but the truth is we handed New Orleans their win, and in spite of our offense wetting the bed against the Bears, the defense played plenty well enough to win that game, too.

I look for a close game. As to who wins, I have no idea. It's a crapshoot with this Vikings team, especially on the road. But if the Vikes play turnover-free football, I think we win. Laugh if you want.

I am not laughing. I don't laugh at any team. It's the NFL. It's a good match up. You seem to think the Pats are not about to unleash some hell they've been waiting to unleash for weeks, and haven't been able to.

I know the Vikes D has been a great 3rd down D, but you seem to keep ignoring your wins have come against crappy teams.

And, I absolutely know who Thielen is. I think it's a challenge for Gilmore, but you act like Thielen is Jerry Rice, which is sort of weird.

This is why Gilmore makes 14 million per year, for situations like this, so we'll see. And, this is just a guess by the way.

As for Zimmer, absolutely. BB has great respect and we've seen the Bengals give NE some issues in the past, with a good brand of D, so I expect nothing different. I expect NE to run it a lot and roll up their sleeves for that reason, and once playaction is achieved, it's going to be real tough for your D.

The question is, do they come right out and show a run commitment since it's obvious, or do they open up in a spread, and sort of let the run game commitment creep in a little as the game goes.

It could be a close game, but it also may not be a close game if NE is finally running on all cylinders on offense for the first time all year.
Easy, big fella. No reason to get defensive.

I don't expect us to come into Foxboro and wallop the Patriots. I have no idea what's going to transpire. I'm just saying that it's very unlikely you know as much about my team as I do about yours. That's not because I'm some kind of genius. It's because New England is a national game about 3 out of every 4 weeks, while the Vikings, save for this recent run of prime time, are mostly regional. Every media outlet loves the Patriots. Nobody loves the Vikings. Nobody believes in them except Vikings fans.

Gilmore is an excellent defensive back. But Thielen is no joke, and you -- like virtually every opponent we've faced -- appear to take him more lightly than you should. Your "sorta weird" comment proves it, although you're far from the first to say it, and most others have come away going, "Wow, that guy really IS good." Jerry Rice? No. Among the top 5 receivers in the NFL? Easily. The man has nine 100-yard games. With one more, he'll tie for 2nd most in a season in NFL history. With two more, he'll tie the top spot. If he sees single coverage, he'll have 7-10 catches, minimum, and I don't care who covers him. Nobody in the NFL is better at the top of the route. DBs have no idea what route he's running. When he's covered, he catches it anyway. The only thing he's probably not going to do is burn you over the top. But he gets a LOT of 20-30 yard gains. He also operates a lot out of the slot. Is Gilmore a slot corner? I don't know ... I'm asking. Anyway, enough gushing about my favorite player. Just watch. You'll see. That's all I'm saying. You think it's weird. So does every other opponents' fans. Think what you want. I know what the man does week in and week out.

As for your offense, I find your comment "if NE is finally running on all cylinders on offense for the first time all year" to be very telling. If you haven't hit on all cylinders all year, what on earth could possibly make you believe it'll happen against a top-5 defense like ours, coached by a man who rivals Belichick for his ability to make in-game adjustments? With all due respect, I don't get it. Again, we're good against the run. Not No. 1, but top-6, and improving weekly. We've given up the fewest runs of 15 yards or more in the league. We've got playmakers and talent at every level. Play action? We get a LOT of coverage sacks. There is no one better at coaching defensive back play in the entire NFL than Mike Zimmer. Our guys can cover. Even our backups.

And I'm sorry to say it, but your offense has gotten slow. Gronk has slowed way down (now watch him burn us). Unless Gordon breaks out, you have no deep threat. Cordarrelle Patterson has been effective running the ball for you, but he's never been a route runner and still isn't. Sony Michel is the real deal ... he scares me a bit. But your O-line doesn't. Neither do your other receivers. Brady is the X-factor. He can always beat any team. Josh McDaniels is an excellent play caller and offensive mind. But I seriously doubt you're going to roll over this defense. Nobody has for the past 7 weeks. And your offense is not what it has been in past years. You've admitted that.

You are correct ... we haven't beaten a team with a winning record. That's an embarrassing knock against us, and until we do it, nobody is going to take us seriously. But the truth is, every game we've lost or tied except for the Rams, we beat ourselves (and even in that game, we were driving for the tying TD when Cousins got strip-sacked). That's our problem. We make costly turnovers. We miss field goals. We take stupid penalties. We're our own worst enemy. We're not the team we should be. I fully admit that. We have the talent to be among the truly elite teams in the NFL, probably top-3 roster talent. But for some reason, we're not maximizing it. Until we do something like knock you guys off, we don't belong in any Super Bowl conversation. You guys ... you find ways to win. Have for 18 years. Belichick is an a$$, but he's brilliant. Brady is as good as there's ever been. That's tough to beat. I know that. You guys don't typically beat yourselves. And that may well be the difference.

You guys are favored. You should be (not by 7 IMO, but it is what it is). I respect your team and organization a lot, even though I get tired of enduring the endless coverage of them. All I'm saying is, don't be surprised if we knock you off. That's all. And if we lose ... well, I'm sad to say that won't surprise me, either. Not in the least. We've proven we can play with anybody ... and we've proven we can lose to anybody. Which Vikings team shows up Sunday? Your guess is as good as mine.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:13 am

J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:14 pm
PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:11 am



I am not laughing. I don't laugh at any team. It's the NFL. It's a good match up. You seem to think the Pats are not about to unleash some hell they've been waiting to unleash for weeks, and haven't been able to.

I know the Vikes D has been a great 3rd down D, but you seem to keep ignoring your wins have come against crappy teams.

And, I absolutely know who Thielen is. I think it's a challenge for Gilmore, but you act like Thielen is Jerry Rice, which is sort of weird.

This is why Gilmore makes 14 million per year, for situations like this, so we'll see. And, this is just a guess by the way.

As for Zimmer, absolutely. BB has great respect and we've seen the Bengals give NE some issues in the past, with a good brand of D, so I expect nothing different. I expect NE to run it a lot and roll up their sleeves for that reason, and once playaction is achieved, it's going to be real tough for your D.

The question is, do they come right out and show a run commitment since it's obvious, or do they open up in a spread, and sort of let the run game commitment creep in a little as the game goes.

It could be a close game, but it also may not be a close game if NE is finally running on all cylinders on offense for the first time all year.
Easy, big fella. No reason to get defensive.

I don't expect us to come into Foxboro and wallop the Patriots. I have no idea what's going to transpire. I'm just saying that it's very unlikely you know as much about my team as I do about yours. That's not because I'm some kind of genius. It's because New England is a national game about 3 out of every 4 weeks, while the Vikings, save for this recent run of prime time, are mostly regional. Every media outlet loves the Patriots. Nobody loves the Vikings. Nobody believes in them except Vikings fans.

Gilmore is an excellent defensive back. But Thielen is no joke, and you -- like virtually every opponent we've faced -- appear to take him more lightly than you should. Your "sorta weird" comment proves it, although you're far from the first to say it, and most others have come away going, "Wow, that guy really IS good." Jerry Rice? No. Among the top 5 receivers in the NFL? Easily. The man has nine 100-yard games. With one more, he'll tie for 2nd most in a season in NFL history. With two more, he'll tie the top spot. If he sees single coverage, he'll have 7-10 catches, minimum, and I don't care who covers him. Nobody in the NFL is better at the top of the route. DBs have no idea what route he's running. When he's covered, he catches it anyway. The only thing he's probably not going to do is burn you over the top. But he gets a LOT of 20-30 yard gains. He also operates a lot out of the slot. Is Gilmore a slot corner? I don't know ... I'm asking. Anyway, enough gushing about my favorite player. Just watch. You'll see. That's all I'm saying. You think it's weird. So does every other opponents' fans. Think what you want. I know what the man does week in and week out.

As for your offense, I find your comment "if NE is finally running on all cylinders on offense for the first time all year" to be very telling. If you haven't hit on all cylinders all year, what on earth could possibly make you believe it'll happen against a top-5 defense like ours, coached by a man who rivals Belichick for his ability to make in-game adjustments? With all due respect, I don't get it. Again, we're good against the run. Not No. 1, but top-6, and improving weekly. We've given up the fewest runs of 15 yards or more in the league. We've got playmakers and talent at every level. Play action? We get a LOT of coverage sacks. There is no one better at coaching defensive back play in the entire NFL than Mike Zimmer. Our guys can cover. Even our backups.

And I'm sorry to say it, but your offense has gotten slow. Gronk has slowed way down (now watch him burn us). Unless Gordon breaks out, you have no deep threat. Cordarrelle Patterson has been effective running the ball for you, but he's never been a route runner and still isn't. Sony Michel is the real deal ... he scares me a bit. But your O-line doesn't. Neither do your other receivers. Brady is the X-factor. He can always beat any team. Josh McDaniels is an excellent play caller and offensive mind. But I seriously doubt you're going to roll over this defense. Nobody has for the past 7 weeks. And your offense is not what it has been in past years. You've admitted that.

You are correct ... we haven't beaten a team with a winning record. That's an embarrassing knock against us, and until we do it, nobody is going to take us seriously. But the truth is, every game we've lost or tied except for the Rams, we beat ourselves (and even in that game, we were driving for the tying TD when Cousins got strip-sacked). That's our problem. We make costly turnovers. We miss field goals. We take stupid penalties. We're our own worst enemy. We're not the team we should be. I fully admit that. We have the talent to be among the truly elite teams in the NFL, probably top-3 roster talent. But for some reason, we're not maximizing it. Until we do something like knock you guys off, we don't belong in any Super Bowl conversation. You guys ... you find ways to win. Have for 18 years. Belichick is an a$$, but he's brilliant. Brady is as good as there's ever been. That's tough to beat. I know that. You guys don't typically beat yourselves. And that may well be the difference.

You guys are favored. You should be (not by 7 IMO, but it is what it is). I respect your team and organization a lot, even though I get tired of enduring the endless coverage of them. All I'm saying is, don't be surprised if we knock you off. That's all. And if we lose ... well, I'm sad to say that won't surprise me, either. Not in the least. We've proven we can play with anybody ... and we've proven we can lose to anybody. Which Vikings team shows up Sunday? Your guess is as good as mine.
Your comments are littered with homerism. Honestly that's fine, but that's hilarious.

THielen is a top 5 WR? What's Edelman, top 3? I mean, give me a break. Edelman is on pace for his best season ever and he's been a top 5 WR in the AFC for years, but I am not going to claim he's "easily" top 5 in the league because of that.

And, did you just say our OL doesn't scare you? The greatest OL coach in NFL history (Scarnecchia) and the best OL in the AFC, now healthy wiith Mason and Cannon back, somehow shouldn't scare you in this game? If Brady gets to playaction with these weapons, it's lights out. Sorry, but it is.

Michel. White and even Burkhead should be keeping your D up at night right now with what they represent.

And, the "deep threat" lingo is old and outdated and never used when NE won 3 SBs in 4 years 15 years ago. If they want to let Dorsett, Gordon or even Patterson run by some people deep, great. Or, even Hogan for that matter.

We hear this crap every week about NE never has any players that "scare" anyone, and then the game comes and goes, NE wins and no one says anything until January rolls around.

Look, I get it. Everyone is sick of NE's insane, sustained run, so it has to end. I am not sure that applies here on Sunday in the way you think it does.

Your comments alone speak to this. Gilmore will contain Thielen, if het gets that assignment. A contained Thielen for 4 or 5 grabs and 60 yards probably isn't going to cut it. Gilmore is not a slot CB and I am not sure if rookie Duke Dawson starts and gets the assignment on Thielen, to be honest. I have no idea, nor does any Pats fan, nor do you, Cousins or Thielen. That's also my point with Cousins is he's facing BB here on the road. You act like this means nothing along with COusins unable to compete with good teams. It means something because it's a long established pattern. And, don't get behind in this game.

As for BB, players love playing for him, he's lauded by all levels of the sport throughout the country, constantly asked to speak at all kinds of institutions, and Jim Brown called him the most generous coach or athlete with his time in philanthropic work in the community. Far from an ####. MIke Zimmer is an #### because he looks grumpy at the podium, too. How does that sound?
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by Raptorman » Sat Dec 01, 2018 12:13 pm

Beating the Pats is simple. Hit Brady. After you knock him down about 5 times in the first quarter he gets pissed and start yelling at his O-line. From that point on he is uncomfortable in the pocket and it has an affect on his passes.

Funny thing, after reading the post of Pats fans on their forums, one player they didn't seem to mention. Cook. I couldn't find one comment in 3 forums that even mentioned him as a possible threat. Tells me all I need to know about how much Pats fans know about the Vikes.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Sat Dec 01, 2018 7:09 pm

PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:13 am
Your comments are littered with homerism. Honestly that's fine, but that's hilarious.

THielen is a top 5 WR? What's Edelman, top 3? I mean, give me a break. Edelman is on pace for his best season ever and he's been a top 5 WR in the AFC for years, but I am not going to claim he's "easily" top 5 in the league because of that.
So let me get this straight.

You believe Julian Edelman to be a better receiver than Adam Thielen. Right now?

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Now that, my friend, is homerism at its finest.

This is Edelman's best season, huh? At his current pace, he'd catch 96-98 balls over 16 games (which he can't reach because ... oh yeah, that pesky PED suspension). That's good production. Nice production in today's NFL. Thielen has 93 through 11, on pace for 135. His catch rate is higher. His YPC is higher. He's on pace for 1,655 yards and 12 TDs to Edelman's 1,165 and 7. Again, nice numbers, but not in Thielen's galaxy. Hell, Stefon Diggs (126/1,260/11 pace) has better numbers than Edelman.

Man, that is some good stuff you're smoking.

Let me tell you what. If you asked 32 NFL coaches to pick between the Thielen and Edelman, 31 would pick Thielen without hesitating. And Belichick would probably only hesitate about one or two seconds before picking Thielen (since he's so adept at jettisoning good players just before their expiration date ... what a great guy!).

It's obvious to me that you've never actually seen Adam Thielen play. That's OK. You'll see tomorrow.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PacificNorseWest » Sun Dec 02, 2018 7:47 am

:lol: At Thielen not being top 5 right now. Everyone everywhere recognizes this except this guy...

The few things that worry me about today's game is the fact that the game is in NE, Gronkowski and the mismatch this creates, as well as Edelman out of the slot.

There's nothing they can do about playing in NE, just gotta come to play. In terms of Gronk, Anthony Harris needs to be assigned to him. Barr isn't good in coverage and what Kendricks makes up in heart, he lacks in size...He's have no chance against Gronk.

Alexander has been better and better, but Edelman is tough. They'll need to do a good job of a man zone concept with short to intermediate routes with him in passing him off to an LB in coverage.

If the Vikings get to to Brady consistently, the result should be favorable. Brady has looked more and more like the 41-year old he is this year as he coils under pressure, his rhythm more disturbed and as mentioned, he gets frustrated quickly.

Offensively, Cook needs to show out. Period.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by Texas Vike » Sun Dec 02, 2018 2:10 pm

Poop. Diggs' knee swelled yesterday evening, so he's a game time decision after indications all week pointed to his being able to play. I fear that even if he does play, he'll be tentative / less effective and man do we need him today. I wish Treadwell weren't such a putz. (Note to self: 2019 draft, I'd like one of the Longhorns WRs--tall and sure handed).

Fox pre-game had a great Patriots-focused segment that included an interview with Belichek. Some of the talking heads thought it would come down to the trenches and specifically who pressures the opposing QB better. I couldn't agree more. The key for us is to hit Brady, early, often, and hard.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by Bowhunting Viking » Sun Dec 02, 2018 3:22 pm

I saw the same thing on Fox when they were talking about which team would be able to pressure the opposing QB the most.
On ESPN Dave Wannstedt said he felt the Vikes would win and he felt the key would be for us to get the running game going and keep Brady and the Pats O off the field.
I hope we can get Murray and Cook going, especially if , and hope it isn't the fact, Diggs can't play. Without Diggs they will definitely be keying on Theilen, and as stated it's hard to trust Treadwell.
I would really the love to see a good old fashioned ground game and just harass the crap out of Brady.
If the Bucs hang on and beat Carolina and we can be fortunate enough to win today that wild card spot is looking more attainable.
Guess we will know here in a bit. I just hope we can prove all the doubters wrong today.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by Bowhunting Viking » Sun Dec 02, 2018 3:26 pm

YESSS Rhoades and Diggs both active. Hope they are effective and stay healthy
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Sun Dec 02, 2018 8:17 pm

Bowhunting Viking wrote:
Sun Dec 02, 2018 3:22 pm
I saw the same thing on Fox when they were talking about which team would be able to pressure the opposing QB the most.
On ESPN Dave Wannstedt said he felt the Vikes would win and he felt the key would be for us to get the running game going and keep Brady and the Pats O off the field.
I hope we can get Murray and Cook going, especially if , and hope it isn't the fact, Diggs can't play. Without Diggs they will definitely be keying on Theilen, and as stated it's hard to trust Treadwell.
I would really the love to see a good old fashioned ground game and just harass the crap out of Brady.
If the Bucs hang on and beat Carolina and we can be fortunate enough to win today that wild card spot is looking more attainable.
Guess we will know here in a bit. I just hope we can prove all the doubters wrong today.
Every former coach victimized by BB or jealous of BB, pretty much always picks against NE.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Sun Dec 02, 2018 8:19 pm

PacificNorseWest wrote:
Sun Dec 02, 2018 7:47 am
:lol: At Thielen not being top 5 right now. Everyone everywhere recognizes this except this guy...

The few things that worry me about today's game is the fact that the game is in NE, Gronkowski and the mismatch this creates, as well as Edelman out of the slot.

There's nothing they can do about playing in NE, just gotta come to play. In terms of Gronk, Anthony Harris needs to be assigned to him. Barr isn't good in coverage and what Kendricks makes up in heart, he lacks in size...He's have no chance against Gronk.

Alexander has been better and better, but Edelman is tough. They'll need to do a good job of a man zone concept with short to intermediate routes with him in passing him off to an LB in coverage.

If the Vikings get to to Brady consistently, the result should be favorable. Brady has looked more and more like the 41-year old he is this year as he coils under pressure, his rhythm more disturbed and as mentioned, he gets frustrated quickly.

Offensively, Cook needs to show out. Period.
Not to be critical, but Edelman is not Welker. He's better than Welker and not a slot WR. He mainly lines up at the Z. To this day, I have no idea how or why the media gets away with misleading the average NFL fan of what kind of a WR he is.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PurpleKoolaid » Sun Dec 02, 2018 8:21 pm

PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Sun Dec 02, 2018 8:17 pm
Bowhunting Viking wrote:
Sun Dec 02, 2018 3:22 pm
I saw the same thing on Fox when they were talking about which team would be able to pressure the opposing QB the most.
On ESPN Dave Wannstedt said he felt the Vikes would win and he felt the key would be for us to get the running game going and keep Brady and the Pats O off the field.
I hope we can get Murray and Cook going, especially if , and hope it isn't the fact, Diggs can't play. Without Diggs they will definitely be keying on Theilen, and as stated it's hard to trust Treadwell.
I would really the love to see a good old fashioned ground game and just harass the crap out of Brady.
If the Bucs hang on and beat Carolina and we can be fortunate enough to win today that wild card spot is looking more attainable.
Guess we will know here in a bit. I just hope we can prove all the doubters wrong today.
Every former coach victimized by BB or jealous of BB, pretty much always picks against NE.
Go away.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Mon Dec 03, 2018 9:49 am

J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 7:09 pm
PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 11:13 am
Your comments are littered with homerism. Honestly that's fine, but that's hilarious.

THielen is a top 5 WR? What's Edelman, top 3? I mean, give me a break. Edelman is on pace for his best season ever and he's been a top 5 WR in the AFC for years, but I am not going to claim he's "easily" top 5 in the league because of that.
So let me get this straight.

You believe Julian Edelman to be a better receiver than Adam Thielen. Right now?

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Now that, my friend, is homerism at its finest.

This is Edelman's best season, huh? At his current pace, he'd catch 96-98 balls over 16 games (which he can't reach because ... oh yeah, that pesky PED suspension). That's good production. Nice production in today's NFL. Thielen has 93 through 11, on pace for 135. His catch rate is higher. His YPC is higher. He's on pace for 1,655 yards and 12 TDs to Edelman's 1,165 and 7. Again, nice numbers, but not in Thielen's galaxy. Hell, Stefon Diggs (126/1,260/11 pace) has better numbers than Edelman.

Man, that is some good stuff you're smoking.

Let me tell you what. If you asked 32 NFL coaches to pick between the Thielen and Edelman, 31 would pick Thielen without hesitating. And Belichick would probably only hesitate about one or two seconds before picking Thielen (since he's so adept at jettisoning good players just before their expiration date ... what a great guy!).

It's obvious to me that you've never actually seen Adam Thielen play. That's OK. You'll see tomorrow.
Yes, I do. Did you watch the game last night? Edelman is on pace for his BEST season ever as a Patriot. Do the math. If he's been top 5 in the AFC for 5 years, and he's producing at his best rate ever, he has to be easily as good as Thielen.

Your homerism is amazing here. I kept warning you NE would contain or take out Thielen. I am not sure if that's disrespect of NE's D or what it is, but you were wrong.

Pats fans have heard the stats argument for years and then I turn on my tv and I see Edelman making key plays at key times, while Thielen is busy rehearsing childish TD celebrations instead.

Of course I've seen Thielen play. He's a really good player, but he hasn't had a better career over Edelman and still won't this year either.

Your talk is exactly why everyone gets pissed off when NE is in the title game every year and maybe the SB. You're so sick of the Pats, you see what you want to see.

For 2 decades, NE's players lack respect because BB schemes from week to week and the production is spread around, so the stats/eye popping production argument is weak.

Edelman>>Welker, but Welker produced more so. How's that sound?

Of course I'd pick Thielen over Edelman today based on age, but that's the ONLY reason I would. I mean, how insulting to a guy who has earned his spot in the league vs a guy who is just coming into his prime now.

And, honestly, I was not impressed with his maturity last night or his whining when the going got tough. Give me 11 Edelmans over 11 Thielens all day, everyday.
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J. Kapp 11
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:02 am

Nobody here cares.

You won the game. Good for you. If you have an ounce of integrity, you'll admit that I told you that's what probably would happen. I said you were favored, and you should have been. You guys don't lose at home in December.

As for Thielen, his behavior with Belichick was uncalled for, although Belichick's response wasn't terribly mature, either. But your defense didn't take Thielen out of the game. Thielen was open plenty. Your defense took Kirk Cousins out of the game. That's because our idiot offensive coordinator refused to do what was working, which was Dalvin Cook gashing you on running plays. You kept blitzing, and we just kept taking deep drops and running Diggs and Thielen down the field with no chance of hitting them. Play-action? John DeFilippo doesn't seem to know what those are. What actually happened yesterday was that your Hall-of-Fame head coach schooled our offensive coordinator. As if any of us didn't see that coming.

Don't like touchdown celebrations? Too bad. They're part of football now. Your opinion about them doesn't change anything. You think your team is above them? Send a post card to someone who gives a damn.

Just go on back to Boston and enjoy the rest of your season. The rest of us will return to living in football anonymity and trying to ignore the never-ending Patriots love fest in the media.
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Pondering Her Percy
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:13 am

PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Mon Dec 03, 2018 9:49 am
J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Sat Dec 01, 2018 7:09 pm

So let me get this straight.

You believe Julian Edelman to be a better receiver than Adam Thielen. Right now?

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Now that, my friend, is homerism at its finest.

This is Edelman's best season, huh? At his current pace, he'd catch 96-98 balls over 16 games (which he can't reach because ... oh yeah, that pesky PED suspension). That's good production. Nice production in today's NFL. Thielen has 93 through 11, on pace for 135. His catch rate is higher. His YPC is higher. He's on pace for 1,655 yards and 12 TDs to Edelman's 1,165 and 7. Again, nice numbers, but not in Thielen's galaxy. Hell, Stefon Diggs (126/1,260/11 pace) has better numbers than Edelman.

Man, that is some good stuff you're smoking.

Let me tell you what. If you asked 32 NFL coaches to pick between the Thielen and Edelman, 31 would pick Thielen without hesitating. And Belichick would probably only hesitate about one or two seconds before picking Thielen (since he's so adept at jettisoning good players just before their expiration date ... what a great guy!).

It's obvious to me that you've never actually seen Adam Thielen play. That's OK. You'll see tomorrow.
Yes, I do. Did you watch the game last night? Edelman is on pace for his BEST season ever as a Patriot. Do the math. If he's been top 5 in the AFC for 5 years, and he's producing at his best rate ever, he has to be easily as good as Thielen.

Your homerism is amazing here. I kept warning you NE would contain or take out Thielen. I am not sure if that's disrespect of NE's D or what it is, but you were wrong.

Pats fans have heard the stats argument for years and then I turn on my tv and I see Edelman making key plays at key times, while Thielen is busy rehearsing childish TD celebrations instead.

Of course I've seen Thielen play. He's a really good player, but he hasn't had a better career over Edelman and still won't this year either.

Your talk is exactly why everyone gets pissed off when NE is in the title game every year and maybe the SB. You're so sick of the Pats, you see what you want to see.

For 2 decades, NE's players lack respect because BB schemes from week to week and the production is spread around, so the stats/eye popping production argument is weak.

Edelman>>Welker, but Welker produced more so. How's that sound?

Of course I'd pick Thielen over Edelman today based on age, but that's the ONLY reason I would. I mean, how insulting to a guy who has earned his spot in the league vs a guy who is just coming into his prime now.

And, honestly, I was not impressed with his maturity last night or his whining when the going got tough. Give me 11 Edelmans over 11 Thielens all day, everyday.
You talk about homerism but you’re sitting here saying not only is Edelman going to have a better career but saying he won’t this year either?? What?!!! Thielen has already done more this year than Edelman has done any year of his career. And he still has FOUR games left!! Classic patriots fan. Nobody is better than any of their players. Julian Edelman is a nobody if it wasn’t for Brady. No different than wes welker. Thielen made it on his own, with multiple different QBs. Give Edelman Keenum, Bradford or cousins and we’ll see how good Edelman really is. He’s a product of your system that would be just another slot guy anywhere else.

Go home, you’re drunk
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:26 am

J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:02 am
Nobody here cares.

You won the game. Good for you. If you have an ounce of integrity, you'll admit that I told you that's what probably would happen. I said you were favored, and you should have been. You guys don't lose at home in December.

As for Thielen, his behavior with Belichick was uncalled for, although Belichick's response wasn't terribly mature, either. But your defense didn't take Thielen out of the game. Thielen was open plenty. Your defense took Kirk Cousins out of the game. That's because our idiot offensive coordinator refused to do what was working, which was Dalvin Cook gashing you on running plays. You kept blitzing, and we just kept taking deep drops and running Diggs and Thielen down the field with no chance of hitting them. Play-action? John DeFilippo doesn't seem to know what those are. What actually happened yesterday was that your Hall-of-Fame head coach schooled our offensive coordinator. As if any of us didn't see that coming.

Don't like touchdown celebrations? Too bad. They're part of football now. Your opinion about them doesn't change anything. You think your team is above them? Send a post card to someone who gives a damn.

Just go on back to Boston and enjoy the rest of your season. The rest of us will return to living in football anonymity and trying to ignore the never-ending Patriots love fest in the media.
I didn't you say you didn't say NE would win. Yes, the D completely removed Thielen from the game. 5 catches for 28 yards?

And, sorry, but when you're a clear 1/2 yard short on a 1st down, after getting some very generous calls earlier in the game (Edelman mauled at the 1 with his arm grabbed and hip flipped or Rudolph clearly not holding onto the ball to the ground), no one needs to fake an injury on a clear challenge due to the insanely ridiculous spot of that ball. It appeared to me Chung had a stinger, but it had no bearing on needing time to see a replay. He was clearly stoned 1/2 yard short and a slam dunk red flag was coming out.

I have no issue with BB telling a mouthy kid to shut his mouth, either. As if the horrendous spot call wasn't enough?

Yes, I think taking time to practice stupid end zone celebrations is dumb, childish and a waste of time, and it disrespects the opponent.

Millennials have a lot of dumb ideas. I would be cringing if I saw a Pats player doing that. It looks even worse that Thielen didn't rise up and was more concerned about orchestrating 1 TD celebration in the game. Yes. I am sorry you can't admit that. 5 catches for 28 yards? I predicted he'd get 60, but he was completely shut down after some of you bragged about him being top 5, which is ludicrous. I can see top 10, maybe 9th or 10th in the league, sure. It's just homerism there.

They were daring Cook to run because their focus was the pass. BB does this. He knows they wanted to pass, so they concede the run with a light front in the Amoeba D. It's not "gashing". They conceded knowing their true desires, schematically. The trap was set, but in the end BB knew DeFillippo wanted to pass a lot. I get it. I'd be frustrated, too, because I've seen Brady/McDaniels do this and lose SBs over it. So, I get that part. Stubborness is a bad trait for a coordinator or coach.

As I've said in the other thread here, your issue is a weak GM. He paid Cousins 28 mil per because Ozzie Newsome (now fired for it), put his team in a raging cap hell and still hasn't recovered from the Flacco move due to a failure to budget. If you can't learn what NOT to do as a GM, you shouldn't be a GM. Spielman needs to go, IMO.

The clear choice was to sign Keenum at 20 and draft a future QB or two to develop behind him. This would have given you 8 mil approx in FA to spread out o help your depth, especially on the OL.
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