Patriots Pre-Game Thread

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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by UKno1VIKING » Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:30 am

Forecasted heavy rain in Foxborough on sunday. How are Tom's tiny hands going to be able to hold onto the ball? Check the ball pressure Zim!!
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Fri Nov 30, 2018 8:54 am

PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 9:06 pm

I wouldn't read too much into that stat. That may be true, but he's missed Edelman for 4 weeks and then lost a combo of Gronk and or Michel for the rest of that time. Don't play zone and don't blitz. Just saying. He kills it. He has all his guys back now. All of that data is representative of that.

You have to play man mostly and disguise zone, but if you do blitz, hide the hell out of it.
You must not get to see the Vikings much in your part of the country (unlike the rest of us, who are forced to watch the Pats virtually every Sunday).

Mike Zimmer is among the best in the NFL at disguising blitzes. His team is experienced in his system and plays it well. At times, you'll see them put 9 men on the line of scrimmage and blitz nobody. Other times, nobody will show blitz, and then the slot corner or Harrison Smith will bust through. Other times, they'll mug the A-Gap, then blitz an outside corner from nowhere. But the truth is that the Vikings blitz very little. Our front four is so good and so deep that we don't have to, especially now that Everson Griffen is back and playing at a high level. Every man across the front can get pressure, which makes it impossible to simply double-team the star. Sheldon Richardson is one of the top pass-rushing tackles not named Aaron Donald, a maniac on stunts and twists. Danielle Hunter can be unstoppable off of either edge. Double him, and Griffen goes off. Brady is going to have to do his usual ... get rid of the ball quickly ... in order to avoid the rush. That helps keep big plays to a minimum.

As for coverage, we play plenty of man, but the truth is we play a lot of combo coverage. We have that flexibility because we rarely have fewer than 7 in coverage. If Xavier Rhodes is out, that hurts us. He would probably shadow Josh Gordon, who has burned the Vikings in the past (although that was under Leslie Frazier's defense, whom just about everybody burned).

Don't let the beginning of this season fool you. Yes, our defense was playing below par for the first month. But they're on a roll now. Held Drew Brees to 120 yards passing, Stafford to 199, Trubisky to 165, and Rodgers to 198. That's in the past four games. Our defense has played like what it was last year, the best in football. It's the offense that has let us down, with costly turnovers in the Saints and Bears game.

I do worry some about Cordarrelle Patterson. Belichick and McDaniels have found innovative ways to use him. He could be an X-factor for you guys. He's the guy on your roster who can take any play to the house. But I guarantee you, Zimmer knows this. He's talked about it all week.

You mention bracketing Diggs and single-covering Thielen. I hope you do that. Thielen will go off. He can't be covered one-on-one. I know Gilmore is good, but you don't know Adam Thielen. Nobody in football is better at the top of his route. He can shake press coverage, he always gets separation, and he catches anything near him. And at a solid 4.4, he's also faster than you think. So please ... single Adam Thielen. Or single Diggs if you want. That's the thing about Diggs and Thielen. No matter which one you double, the other is getting open. It's also why it hurts the Vikings when one of them is out. But when they both play, they produce. Shoot, even when we stunk against the Bears, they had 20 receptions.

The key for us will be to not beat ourselves with turnovers and stupid penalties, like Laquon Treadwell's idiotic unsportsmanlike penalty in a key moment of the Saints game. If we do that, we can beat the Patriots. You have great, great coaching. Your quarterback has seen it all and is still playing at a high level. But your roster talent doesn't come close to ours, and you'll see that Sunday. Plus, we're pretty well-coached, too. I think the line of New England -7 is ridiculous and doesn't give the Vikings enough respect. Perhaps their spotty play has earned that, but the truth is we handed New Orleans their win, and in spite of our offense wetting the bed against the Bears, the defense played plenty well enough to win that game, too.

I look for a close game. As to who wins, I have no idea. It's a crapshoot with this Vikings team, especially on the road. But if the Vikes play turnover-free football, I think we win. Laugh if you want.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Fri Nov 30, 2018 9:58 am

UKno1VIKING wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:30 am
Forecasted heavy rain in Foxborough on sunday. How are Tom's tiny hands going to be able to hold onto the ball? Check the ball pressure Zim!!
^Just sad you believe cheater Goodell and the cheating owners involved. Do you believe in the tooth fairy, too? lmao
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:11 am

J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 8:54 am
PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 9:06 pm



I wouldn't read too much into that stat. That may be true, but he's missed Edelman for 4 weeks and then lost a combo of Gronk and or Michel for the rest of that time. Don't play zone and don't blitz. Just saying. He kills it. He has all his guys back now. All of that data is representative of that.

You have to play man mostly and disguise zone, but if you do blitz, hide the hell out of it.
You must not get to see the Vikings much in your part of the country (unlike the rest of us, who are forced to watch the Pats virtually every Sunday).

Mike Zimmer is among the best in the NFL at disguising blitzes. His team is experienced in his system and plays it well. At times, you'll see them put 9 men on the line of scrimmage and blitz nobody. Other times, nobody will show blitz, and then the slot corner or Harrison Smith will bust through. Other times, they'll mug the A-Gap, then blitz an outside corner from nowhere. But the truth is that the Vikings blitz very little. Our front four is so good and so deep that we don't have to, especially now that Everson Griffen is back and playing at a high level. Every man across the front can get pressure, which makes it impossible to simply double-team the star. Sheldon Richardson is one of the top pass-rushing tackles not named Aaron Donald, a maniac on stunts and twists. Danielle Hunter can be unstoppable off of either edge. Double him, and Griffen goes off. Brady is going to have to do his usual ... get rid of the ball quickly ... in order to avoid the rush. That helps keep big plays to a minimum.

As for coverage, we play plenty of man, but the truth is we play a lot of combo coverage. We have that flexibility because we rarely have fewer than 7 in coverage. If Xavier Rhodes is out, that hurts us. He would probably shadow Josh Gordon, who has burned the Vikings in the past (although that was under Leslie Frazier's defense, whom just about everybody burned).

Don't let the beginning of this season fool you. Yes, our defense was playing below par for the first month. But they're on a roll now. Held Drew Brees to 120 yards passing, Stafford to 199, Trubisky to 165, and Rodgers to 198. That's in the past four games. Our defense has played like what it was last year, the best in football. It's the offense that has let us down, with costly turnovers in the Saints and Bears game.

I do worry some about Cordarrelle Patterson. Belichick and McDaniels have found innovative ways to use him. He could be an X-factor for you guys. He's the guy on your roster who can take any play to the house. But I guarantee you, Zimmer knows this. He's talked about it all week.

You mention bracketing Diggs and single-covering Thielen. I hope you do that. Thielen will go off. He can't be covered one-on-one. I know Gilmore is good, but you don't know Adam Thielen. Nobody in football is better at the top of his route. He can shake press coverage, he always gets separation, and he catches anything near him. And at a solid 4.4, he's also faster than you think. So please ... single Adam Thielen. Or single Diggs if you want. That's the thing about Diggs and Thielen. No matter which one you double, the other is getting open. It's also why it hurts the Vikings when one of them is out. But when they both play, they produce. Shoot, even when we stunk against the Bears, they had 20 receptions.

The key for us will be to not beat ourselves with turnovers and stupid penalties, like Laquon Treadwell's idiotic unsportsmanlike penalty in a key moment of the Saints game. If we do that, we can beat the Patriots. You have great, great coaching. Your quarterback has seen it all and is still playing at a high level. But your roster talent doesn't come close to ours, and you'll see that Sunday. Plus, we're pretty well-coached, too. I think the line of New England -7 is ridiculous and doesn't give the Vikings enough respect. Perhaps their spotty play has earned that, but the truth is we handed New Orleans their win, and in spite of our offense wetting the bed against the Bears, the defense played plenty well enough to win that game, too.

I look for a close game. As to who wins, I have no idea. It's a crapshoot with this Vikings team, especially on the road. But if the Vikes play turnover-free football, I think we win. Laugh if you want.

I am not laughing. I don't laugh at any team. It's the NFL. It's a good match up. You seem to think the Pats are not about to unleash some hell they've been waiting to unleash for weeks, and haven't been able to.

I know the Vikes D has been a great 3rd down D, but you seem to keep ignoring your wins have come against crappy teams.

And, I absolutely know who Thielen is. I think it's a challenge for Gilmore, but you act like Thielen is Jerry Rice, which is sort of weird.

This is why Gilmore makes 14 million per year, for situations like this, so we'll see. And, this is just a guess by the way.

As for Zimmer, absolutely. BB has great respect and we've seen the Bengals give NE some issues in the past, with a good brand of D, so I expect nothing different. I expect NE to run it a lot and roll up their sleeves for that reason, and once playaction is achieved, it's going to be real tough for your D.

The question is, do they come right out and show a run commitment since it's obvious, or do they open up in a spread, and sort of let the run game commitment creep in a little as the game goes.

It could be a close game, but it also may not be a close game if NE is finally running on all cylinders on offense for the first time all year.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:21 am

mansquatch wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 2:01 pm
PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 10:27 am


This is how BB usually does it.

You may see new acquisition, Obi Melofonwu (Hybrid Safety/LB @ 230 lbs - think Chancellor) be used up and around the line of scrimmage on the weakside, mainly. Ge got his first handful of snaps last week off the Bye in what they call the Quarters package which no slot CB and 4 Safeties instead.

They'll use him on Cook and to spy on Cousins.

if I had to guess it's Jason McCourty with Harmon bracketed on Diggs. Gilmore would then be asked to remove Thielen when in single man.

Chung on Rudolph in man.
I will say that in looking at your schedule, your guys have not yet matched up with WR of the quality that MN will bring on Sunday. It might not be possible to bracket both of them. I suspect a key component to this game will be Cousins identifying where the defense is weak and either opting into a different play or adjusting his reads accordingly. I suspect that the Vikings having some flexibility on offense will pay dividends given the diversity of quality skill players on our offense. Obviously this is predicated on the OL's ability to maintain some level of protection. Of course despite our issues i do not feel like the Patriots' DL is in the same league as a Chicago, so I do not think they are going to be able to completely steal the game.

On offense I think you'll be surprised at our Defense and what it brings to the table.

This should be an excellent game for fans of both teams. Lots of things to pay attention to.
I would consider KC every bit the firepower if not more than Minnesota, maybe not directly at the WR position, but usually when there is a clear cut duo of favorites and not more balance at the WR position, it's actually easier for BB's Ds to have a clear cut focus to defend those options.

I may be 100% wrong with how he's going to do it, usually he takes the weaker of the perimeter CBs, in this case Jason McCourty (having a good year), and then pairs that CB with a Safety over the top, which is usually the 2 shell deep, but super deep Harmon over the top.

Like I am saying, this new guy they signed cut by Gruden in Oakland (2017 2nd rd pick from UConn,a guy BB liked a lot and worked out), Melinfonwu, is 6'3, 230 lbs. This is a hybrid S/LB guy that Shea McClellin was playing in 2016 and what they had Marquis Flowers doing last year.

This chess piece allows for Devon McCourty to go back to his usual over the top shell with Harmon and should add an infusion of speed.

My point is, if he's deployed, you're likely to see a better defense from NE than anyone has seen all year, for the most part, save for the domination of the Packers offense, which technically is more balanced than yours, with the better QB and unknown favorites that Rodgers uses.

The more a BB D knows and can study, the worse it is for NE's opponent on offense.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by UKno1VIKING » Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:29 am

PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 9:58 am
UKno1VIKING wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:30 am
Forecasted heavy rain in Foxborough on sunday. How are Tom's tiny hands going to be able to hold onto the ball? Check the ball pressure Zim!!
^Just sad you believe cheater Goodell and the cheating owners involved. Do you believe in the tooth fairy, too? lmao
Alright, alright. Don't get your panties in a bunch. It was completely tongue in cheek.
so much for "FanIn Peace"
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:33 am

VikingLord wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 6:05 pm
PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 3:46 pm
I wouldn't look at what the Pats looked like 6 weeks ago to compare to your team. That's honestly a rookie mistake, so to speak. If you're hanging on what they did on October 21, you're going to be disappointed on Sunday.
I'm not comparing anything that happened 6 weeks ago to what will happen on Sunday - that was one of my compatriots here on this forum that did that. I just pointed out the underlying details of that result don't support a claim that the Patriots demolished the Bears or are even better than the Bears.

With that said, the Vikings head to New England with no pressure or expectations. Those sit squarely on the shoulders of the Patriots and their fans who expect a win, and judging by your comments here, a fairly easy one.
The Pats had 2 STS TDs in the game. They demolished them and Chicago got a late garbage time TD and that was it.

They controlled the game from the 1st qtr on. Yes, they demolished them.

If you didn't see the game, cool.

I never said anything about a win or an easy one. I am saying that you can't look at NE's previous 2 months and hang your hat on that, because fans have been waiting all year for this team to be healthy and show their starters. There's been a lot of moving parts and discombobulation, in particular on offense, for the first time in years, probably since 2013.

If anything, I am seeing some strong confidence from Vikings fans going into Gillette which is fine, but also a bit of a head scratcher considering NE's health/confidence in getting quality players back for once.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:36 am

UKno1VIKING wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:29 am
PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 9:58 am


^Just sad you believe cheater Goodell and the cheating owners involved. Do you believe in the tooth fairy, too? lmao
Alright, alright. Don't get your panties in a bunch. It was completely tongue in cheek.
so much for "FanIn Peace"
How is it not peaceful? Something dumb was said, you apparently want Goodell to keep up with his cheating shenanigans to be able to steal draft picks from an NFL team and defame them in the process, etc.

I don't.

Pretty simple.

If you can show me another sports league where owners meet to try to manipulate rules to give problems to a dynasty franchise that is simply really great over a period of time, I am willing to accept that is somewhat normal behavior by another commissioner in another pro sports league, but I've yet to find it. Nor have I found a commissioner lying in federal courts as frequently as Goodell has.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:39 am

PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:21 am
mansquatch wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 2:01 pm


I will say that in looking at your schedule, your guys have not yet matched up with WR of the quality that MN will bring on Sunday. It might not be possible to bracket both of them. I suspect a key component to this game will be Cousins identifying where the defense is weak and either opting into a different play or adjusting his reads accordingly. I suspect that the Vikings having some flexibility on offense will pay dividends given the diversity of quality skill players on our offense. Obviously this is predicated on the OL's ability to maintain some level of protection. Of course despite our issues i do not feel like the Patriots' DL is in the same league as a Chicago, so I do not think they are going to be able to completely steal the game.

On offense I think you'll be surprised at our Defense and what it brings to the table.

This should be an excellent game for fans of both teams. Lots of things to pay attention to.
I would consider KC every bit the firepower if not more than Minnesota, maybe not directly at the WR position, but usually when there is a clear cut duo of favorites and not more balance at the WR position, it's actually easier for BB's Ds to have a clear cut focus to defend those options.

I may be 100% wrong with how he's going to do it, usually he takes the weaker of the perimeter CBs, in this case Jason McCourty (having a good year), and then pairs that CB with a Safety over the top, which is usually the 2 shell deep, but super deep Harmon over the top.

Like I am saying, this new guy they signed cut by Gruden in Oakland (2017 2nd rd pick from UConn,a guy BB liked a lot and worked out), Melinfonwu, is 6'3, 230 lbs. This is a hybrid S/LB guy that Shea McClellin was playing in 2016 and what they had Marquis Flowers doing last year.

This chess piece allows for Devon McCourty to go back to his usual over the top shell with Harmon and should add an infusion of speed with this Melinfonwu guy down and around the line of scrimmage and into the flat. So, in a sense, the pieces can go back to what they do well, closer to how well the D played last year from 10.1 --Week 17 of last year, allowing the fewest points in the NFL and into the postseason, save for the fireworks that went off in the SB.

My point is, if he's deployed, you're likely to see a better defense from NE than anyone has seen all year, for the most part, save for the domination of the Packers offense, which technically is more balanced than yours, with the better QB and unknown favorites that Rodgers uses.

The more a BB D knows and can study, the worse it is for NE's opponent on offense.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by UKno1VIKING » Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:39 am

PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:36 am
UKno1VIKING wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:29 am


Alright, alright. Don't get your panties in a bunch. It was completely tongue in cheek.
so much for "FanIn Peace"
How is it not peaceful? Something dumb was said, you apparently want Goodell to keep up with his cheating shenanigans to be able to steal draft picks from an NFL team and defame them in the process, etc.

I don't.

Pretty simple.

If you can show me another sports league where owners meet to try to manipulate rules to give problems to a dynasty franchise that is simply really great over a period of time, I am willing to accept that is somewhat normal behavior by another commissioner in another pro sports league, but I've yet to find it. Nor have I found a commissioner lying in federal courts as frequently as Goodell has.
Hang on, are you saying it was Roger Goodell only?! You mean, Tiny Tim didn't say, "hang on, these are a bit squishy. I don't want to win like this"?

Please. Next you'll be saying man didn't land on the moon :welcome
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:53 am

^SHowing your age with the Tiny Tim reference (that made no sense).

Next you'll be saying Goodell tells the truth and hasn't been called a liar by 3 different federal judges in multiple states, too.

Quick! Look under your pillow for some money the fairy left you after you lost your last tooth.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by VikingLord » Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:00 pm

PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:33 am
The Pats had 2 STS TDs in the game. They demolished them and Chicago got a late garbage time TD and that was it.

They controlled the game from the 1st qtr on. Yes, they demolished them.

If you didn't see the game, cool.
I didn't see the game, but the stats don't suggest the Pats demolished the Bears.

I am curious now what you thought about their recent loss against the Titans. Did they dominate that game too but were done in by bad breaks or something?
PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:33 am
I never said anything about a win or an easy one. I am saying that you can't look at NE's previous 2 months and hang your hat on that, because fans have been waiting all year for this team to be healthy and show their starters. There's been a lot of moving parts and discombobulation, in particular on offense, for the first time in years, probably since 2013.

If anything, I am seeing some strong confidence from Vikings fans going into Gillette which is fine, but also a bit of a head scratcher considering NE's health/confidence in getting quality players back for once.
Have you ever thought that one of these Decembers it's not going to be like it has been for the Patriots? One of these Decembers, they are not going to continue to have that historically aberrant success they've enjoyed for virtually Brady's entire career? Even with all of that health and confidence?
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:15 pm

VikingLord wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:00 pm
PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:33 am
The Pats had 2 STS TDs in the game. They demolished them and Chicago got a late garbage time TD and that was it.

They controlled the game from the 1st qtr on. Yes, they demolished them.

If you didn't see the game, cool.
I didn't see the game, but the stats don't suggest the Pats demolished the Bears.

I am curious now what you thought about their recent loss against the Titans. Did they dominate that game too but were done in by bad breaks or something?
PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 10:33 am
I never said anything about a win or an easy one. I am saying that you can't look at NE's previous 2 months and hang your hat on that, because fans have been waiting all year for this team to be healthy and show their starters. There's been a lot of moving parts and discombobulation, in particular on offense, for the first time in years, probably since 2013.

If anything, I am seeing some strong confidence from Vikings fans going into Gillette which is fine, but also a bit of a head scratcher considering NE's health/confidence in getting quality players back for once.
Have you ever thought that one of these Decembers it's not going to be like it has been for the Patriots? One of these Decembers, they are not going to continue to have that historically aberrant success they've enjoyed for virtually Brady's entire career? Even with all of that health and confidence?


1. Titans Game - I was shocked at how badly all 3 phases played, knowing Vrabel and the other former Pats people on the Titans would treat that like their SB. That's not a first there. Detroit did it on primetime, Jax did it, and all of those teams are now running at a 21% winning pct. since playing their regular season SB, and won't be in the postseason, so there's that. But, yes, if the Pats lose on a 1 seed over it, yes, an obvious regrettable game to remember, sure. They were outplayed across to the board, so you tip your cap and move on.

2. Absolutely. The problem is, the eye test does not show this. Until I see it slowly disintegrating, I am not buying it. 99% of it is media-induced garbage.

When I see Brady get cement shoes vs Tenn, a problem he has had throughout the years, staring down his favorite targets, and walking into traps, I know it to be fixable.

It's not an age thing. It's a discipline/gameplan/playcalling/decision making thing. This "cliff" business isn't there. Sorry. If healthy, NE would be a very, very dangerous team come January in the AFC.

I am not buying it. But, anyone at any time for any team, can certainly sustain an injury or be career ending or whatnot.

It does not make sense for a team that gets better as they go, taking the coaching, etc, to get magically worse. There'd have to be a locker room issue or something going on, which I am not detecting. Last year, yes, there was some annoying and childish locker room drama which was masked, but clearly wasn't a good thing, which is unusual.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by VikingLord » Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:17 pm

PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:15 pm
2. Absolutely. The problem is, the eye test does not show this. Until I see it slowly disintegrating, I am not buying it. 99% of it is media-induced garbage.

When I see Brady get cement shoes vs Tenn, a problem he has had throughout the years, staring down his favorite targets, and walking into traps, I know it to be fixable.

It's not an age thing. It's a discipline/gameplan/playcalling/decision making thing. This "cliff" business isn't there. Sorry. If healthy, NE would be a very, very dangerous team come January in the AFC.

I am not buying it. But, anyone at any time for any team, can certainly sustain an injury or be career ending or whatnot.

It does not make sense for a team that gets better as they go, taking the coaching, etc, to get magically worse. There'd have to be a locker room issue or something going on, which I am not detecting. Last year, yes, there was some annoying and childish locker room drama which was masked, but clearly wasn't a good thing, which is unusual.
OK, but since the Pats came off their bye week they've played 2 games - one against a fairly inconsistent Titans team and one against a fairly poor Jets team. Granted, both were away games, but those are the 2 most recent data points. It would seem to me that your eye test focuses mainly on the Jets game in your assessment of the Patriots heading into this game and into December. Are you willing to consider that your assessment is based more on their historical performance in past seasons at this time of year, which admittedly has been statistically exceptional? You have some cause to extend that past trend line into this season and this upcoming December, but less so if you look at the recent performances *this season*. This is just like the QBR stats posted earlier - Brady has a long history of being exceptional and clearly a top-3 QB, but not *this season*. This season he's a little less exceptional. Still good - just not exceptional. And the Pats have not dominated in their 2 most recent games. They lost one fairly convincingly, but did dominate the other against one of the worst teams in the NFL this year.

Let's say in the upcoming game, the Patriots resemble the team that lost to the Titans more than the team that beat the Jets. Let's say the Vikings start to pressure Brady into sloppy throws and mistakes and leave Foxborough having gifted Brady another pair of cement cleats to go along with the pair he got from the Titans. What then? Will that shake your faith, perhaps make you question whether this December might be a different story after 2 teams in 3 weeks heading into December made Brady look average?

Looking forward to a good, clean game on Sunday.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Fri Nov 30, 2018 9:40 pm

VikingLord wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 4:17 pm
PatsFanInPeace wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 12:15 pm
2. Absolutely. The problem is, the eye test does not show this. Until I see it slowly disintegrating, I am not buying it. 99% of it is media-induced garbage.

When I see Brady get cement shoes vs Tenn, a problem he has had throughout the years, staring down his favorite targets, and walking into traps, I know it to be fixable.

It's not an age thing. It's a discipline/gameplan/playcalling/decision making thing. This "cliff" business isn't there. Sorry. If healthy, NE would be a very, very dangerous team come January in the AFC.

I am not buying it. But, anyone at any time for any team, can certainly sustain an injury or be career ending or whatnot.

It does not make sense for a team that gets better as they go, taking the coaching, etc, to get magically worse. There'd have to be a locker room issue or something going on, which I am not detecting. Last year, yes, there was some annoying and childish locker room drama which was masked, but clearly wasn't a good thing, which is unusual.
OK, but since the Pats came off their bye week they've played 2 games - one against a fairly inconsistent Titans team and one against a fairly poor Jets team. Granted, both were away games, but those are the 2 most recent data points. It would seem to me that your eye test focuses mainly on the Jets game in your assessment of the Patriots heading into this game and into December. Are you willing to consider that your assessment is based more on their historical performance in past seasons at this time of year, which admittedly has been statistically exceptional? You have some cause to extend that past trend line into this season and this upcoming December, but less so if you look at the recent performances *this season*. This is just like the QBR stats posted earlier - Brady has a long history of being exceptional and clearly a top-3 QB, but not *this season*. This season he's a little less exceptional. Still good - just not exceptional. And the Pats have not dominated in their 2 most recent games. They lost one fairly convincingly, but did dominate the other against one of the worst teams in the NFL this year.

Let's say in the upcoming game, the Patriots resemble the team that lost to the Titans more than the team that beat the Jets. Let's say the Vikings start to pressure Brady into sloppy throws and mistakes and leave Foxborough having gifted Brady another pair of cement cleats to go along with the pair he got from the Titans. What then? Will that shake your faith, perhaps make you question whether this December might be a different story after 2 teams in 3 weeks heading into December made Brady look average?

Looking forward to a good, clean game on Sunday.
Yes, I probably would, and I realize injuries can't be excuses, but I think you're undervaluing health in the NFL. Even in the Titans game with Tackles being shuflfed in and out with maladies, the flu, etc, it's still not the best Pats personnel they could really offer. I think you're scrambling for reasons and rationalizing. And, the Jets notoriously, as bad as they usually are, play their best game at home vs NE. Even when NE was it its most powerful in 2014 and 2016, statistically, the Jets do that, especially at home. That's not anything new. You're taking the media cheese that NE is finished. That's all I am saying.

Congrats to Tenn for the win, etc, but if my team is all of a sudden the healthiest it's been all year, it means they haven't peaked yet and are 8-3.

Just saying. They have another gear. Maybe it doesn't come here and the Vikes will have earned a great win, sure.
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