Patriots Pre-Game Thread

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S197
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Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by S197 » Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:25 pm

Bit of a weird year for the Patriots. They've beaten good teams but have lost to teams they shouldn't (Lions & Titans). Of course those were on the road, they are incredibly difficult to beat at home. We need some former coach under BB to be a consultant for the week because apparently they've very good at stopping Brady.

The person I worry about most is James White. He's the prototypical RB that gives this defense fits with his ability to catch the ball out of the backfield. Similar to a Cohen and all the other scat backs that have run that wheel route so successfully. I also wouldn't be surprised if they run a very up tempo offense that limits the ability to sub out defenders. Especially our DL.

As for the Vikings, we absolutely need a running game. It's far too easy for defenses to drop 7 and wait for their front 4 to inevitably get to Cousins. Beebe could be used a little more this game as he's good finding pockets in the zone and Robinson can stretch the field. Treadwell is really only good for his run blocking and tough YAC running but his penchant for drops and inability to create separation is going to be tough against a defense that I think will be content to pressure Cousins mostly through their DL.

The Vikings will need great execution from offense, defense, and special teams to have a shot in this game. If there's lapses is any one of those three aspects, this will be a loss. This is the game where all three phases really need to come together, something I feel like we've still been waiting for and this is week 13.
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720pete
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by 720pete » Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:33 pm

Don't mean to be a downer, but I see no way we win this game. We are a good team but not playing at the level of the Saints, Cheifs, Rams, or Pats.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by halfgiz » Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:01 pm

I worry about Patterson biting us in the butt.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by Cliff » Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:47 pm

Playing QBs like Brady is the reason they've got 3 1st round picks at corner ... and if two of them weren't out I'd feel a lot better about the game.

If the defense can stand up the offense can do enough to win.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by VikingLord » Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:22 pm

720pete wrote:
Tue Nov 27, 2018 4:33 pm
Don't mean to be a downer, but I see no way we win this game. We are a good team but not playing at the level of the Saints, Cheifs, Rams, or Pats.
No way? Really? You think the Pats are still that good?

Do you know that the Patriots are actually ranked lower than the Vikings in terms of passing this year (Minnesota is 7th, New England is 11th), or that the Patriots possess the league's 22nd ranked defense overall? Or that the mythical Tom Brady has shown some serious signs of regression this year (ESPN stats has him ranked #10 in terms of total QBR, while Cousins is ranked #12, with almost all of the difference between the 2 ratings coming from Cousins' negative "Clutch-weighted expected points added through rushes" rating)? No matter what you think of that particular rating, it does measure NFL QB's against each other, and by that metric (or any other you look at this year), Tom Brady is no longer a top-3 QB. And if you are looking for how the Vikings might fare against a Brady this season, they've already played 3 out of the top 4 in that rating (Drew Brees, Mitchell Trubisky, and Jared Goff). Of those 3, Goff had a good day, but the Vikings largely contained the #1 and #2 QBs on that list. Brady could go off, sure, but I think he's much more likely to duplicate the performances of Brees and Trubisky than Goff in this upcoming game.

Sure, the Pats will be favored. They're at home. They have 8 wins. They have Belichek and Brady. They're the Patriots of lore. I say "screw 'em". Vikings can win the game, even comfortably win it, if they show up prepared, with some fire and urgency, and execute. The Patriots will be prepared. They'll execute. But if both teams execute well, the Vikings will win.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by VikingLord » Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:25 pm

Cliff wrote:
Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:47 pm
Playing QBs like Brady is the reason they've got 3 1st round picks at corner ... and if two of them weren't out I'd feel a lot better about the game.

If the defense can stand up the offense can do enough to win.
See my post above. Brady is good, but he's not the Brady of even last year and he's arguably worse than 3 QBs the Vikings have already faced, 2 of which (Brees and Trubisky) they largely neutralized.

If the Patriots win, it's probably going to be because the Vikings shot themselves in the foot again and committed too many key mistakes, or had another slow start. If the Vikings show up ready to play and execute, they will win.
Last edited by VikingLord on Tue Nov 27, 2018 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:08 pm

Make no mistake, the Vikings can win this game.

They're going to need a complete effort. They can't leave points on the board the way they did Sunday against the Packers. But the Patriots are gettable. They're nowhere near as good as they've been in the past. They play in an absolutely pathetic division that virtually guarantees them 6 wins. Their receiving corps is underwhelming, their offensive line has struggled against good pass rushes, and Rob Gronkowski is regressing. So is Tom Brady. It's been outlined here, so I won't go into it. And their defense is very, very average.

There are two huge factors going against us.

1. It's in New England.
2. It's Bill Belichick.

The first point is obvious. The second -- Belichick-coached teams don't typically beat themselves. That's why we have to play an incredibly clean football game. We need some balance on offense, much like we had against Green Bay, and we need to have zero turnovers. We also MUST score when we have the chance -- can't be missing field goals or having false starts on field goals or missing extra points. If we get the ball in plus field position, we've got to get points.

With this Patriots team, if you can keep the game clean and not make stupid mistakes, they can be beaten. They'll be favored. But I feel better about this game than I do about the game in Seattle.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by allday1991 » Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:25 pm

The whole brady talk is hilarious. Dude is still top 3 easily and more than capable of shredding up our defence. No Brady has not fallen off, brees had a down year last year so i guess he was done then to? Talk to any pats fan and they will tell you they're running the ball better than they have in years. White and michell are a great 1 2 and make bradys job easier. These guys hung in with the chiefs and beat them, they controlled chicago all game. We need zero turn overs and a few lucky bounces to win this game.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by 720pete » Wed Nov 28, 2018 9:54 am

Vikings currently have the 3rd most fumbles in the league (9 total) and the second lowest FG% (66.7%) of any team in the league. I would love to see some mistake-free football, but I doubt it will happen.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by neb33 » Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:03 am

No pressure should be on the vikes. Go out and play the game to your fullest, no turnovers and have outstanding special team play and vikes win. We match up very well against this team. IMO
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by VikingLord » Wed Nov 28, 2018 10:44 am

allday1991 wrote:
Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:25 pm
The whole brady talk is hilarious. Dude is still top 3 easily and more than capable of shredding up our defence. No Brady has not fallen off, brees had a down year last year so i guess he was done then to? Talk to any pats fan and they will tell you they're running the ball better than they have in years. White and michell are a great 1 2 and make bradys job easier. These guys hung in with the chiefs and beat them, they controlled chicago all game. We need zero turn overs and a few lucky bounces to win this game.
I posted some actual stats and the QBR rating to back my claim that Brady has regressed. What exactly are you basing your hilarity on and claim that Brady is capable of shredding the Vikings defense beyond his pedigree?

Brady *has* fallen off. His own stats back that claim. Further, this year is this year, and the Tom Brady the Vikings will face on Sunday is the Tom Brady that is playing this year. If this year's version of Tom Brady has regressed a bit (once again, not something I am merely wishing is true, but something that is supported by a variety of stats he himself has put up), then that is the QB the Vikings get to play against.

Let's check back in this thread after the game on Sunday to review how much shredding Brady actually managed against the Vikings defense.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by cmoss84 » Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:09 pm

I'm just excited to see if we can get some shots in on Brady. Can we take him out of the game...at least momentarily? Would love to see Brian Hoyer in the game.

I hope we risk blitzing early and often-even if Brady burns us on it a time or two. Want him to feel as uncomfortable as possible...and if he's under pressure consistently, I could see him becoming skiddish and throwing some balls away.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by 720pete » Wed Nov 28, 2018 5:56 pm

cmoss84 wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 3:09 pm
I'm just excited to see if we can get some shots in on Brady. Can we take him out of the game...at least momentarily? Would love to see Brian Hoyer in the game.

I hope we risk blitzing early and often-even if Brady burns us on it a time or two. Want him to feel as uncomfortable as possible...and if he's under pressure consistently, I could see him becoming skiddish and throwing some balls away.
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PurpleKoolaid » Wed Nov 28, 2018 6:19 pm

Theres a chance we can beat the Pats, but we would have to play really well. And we always make mistakes, with TO's and missed kicks. We leave too many points untouched.

We havent won a game against a winning team this year I dont think. We beat most of the Teams we should, and were shown Chicago can and will be winning more and ore games. Having such a nice remaining opponents, while we go against some really good teams.

Pretty sure its a loss, but would love to see Cousins lead us to a victory in the 4th Qu. :govikes:
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Re: Patriots Pre-Game Thread

Post by PatsFanInPeace » Wed Nov 28, 2018 8:58 pm

S197 wrote:
Tue Nov 27, 2018 2:25 pm
Bit of a weird year for the Patriots. They've beaten good teams but have lost to teams they shouldn't (Lions & Titans). Of course those were on the road, they are incredibly difficult to beat at home. We need some former coach under BB to be a consultant for the week because apparently they've very good at stopping Brady.

The person I worry about most is James White. He's the prototypical RB that gives this defense fits with his ability to catch the ball out of the backfield. Similar to a Cohen and all the other scat backs that have run that wheel route so successfully. I also wouldn't be surprised if they run a very up tempo offense that limits the ability to sub out defenders. Especially our DL.

As for the Vikings, we absolutely need a running game. It's far too easy for defenses to drop 7 and wait for their front 4 to inevitably get to Cousins. Beebe could be used a little more this game as he's good finding pockets in the zone and Robinson can stretch the field. Treadwell is really only good for his run blocking and tough YAC running but his penchant for drops and inability to create separation is going to be tough against a defense that I think will be content to pressure Cousins mostly through their DL.

The Vikings will need great execution from offense, defense, and special teams to have a shot in this game. If there's lapses is any one of those three aspects, this will be a loss. This is the game where all three phases really need to come together, something I feel like we've still been waiting for and this is week 13.

This sounds generally about right. As you can see I am come in peace as a Pats fan. No harm intended here, as I have nothing but respect for the old black and blue division and its history, including the Vikes'.

As an aside, what on earth were they thinking not having a retractable roof on that thing? What an advantage against warm weather or dome teams. Just stunning decision making there, or cheapness.

To be perfectly honest, and this is weird, NE is about 2 weeks behind schedule so to speak, if not more. Maybe 3 or 4 than the norm. They've had trouble putting together a full 60 in all 3 phases week to week, pretty much all year. That said, they have, technically, a new Def Coordinator, some moving parts and some discombobulation on offense that has stalled the progress. Their STs are a top 5 unit literally year except this year they've been bad at 28th in the league. So, a lot of odd things this year, with little change in personnel. That said, they have what it takes and I hope they can stay under the radar some more.

The problem in this game for the Vikes is NE has some health back on offense, where all the guys back at once means around 30 points, especially at home and I noticed MInny's wins this year all have come against crappy teams.

Diggs is nasty, Thielen very good, Rudolph good and Cook looks good, but I am not seeing too much more than that, where NE's D can match up well here with some options to offset those weapons.

Zimmer is also a good coach. You could be doing a lot worse than that, so I would stick with it. Cousins is overpaid badly, but load up on picks and don't overpay anyone else from here on out and you can probably keep going.

Sure, Brady is 1 year older, Gronk not the same guy who can command a double team, but if Brady can get his head out of his #### and spread it around a bit more with some more balance, the STs get its head out its ####, the Pats will be tough to beat the rest of the way.

I also think the Sendejo and Rhodes injuries are big for the Vikes' D in this one. Both are really good players and who doesn't love what Harrison Smith does?

Here's to a good game and I have nothing but respect for the great 70s tradition the Vikes established.

Lastly, it's a bit disappointing to see some fans still rely on the "cheater" label, too, when it's clear what Goodell and these owners have been doing for over 10 years to try to keep parity alive to grow the league. You'd think the Deflategate framejob would have made that very obvious at this point. It's a losers mentality to fall prey to, and for it and not reflect back on your own team, IMO.

Anyway, here's to a good game on Sunday.
Last edited by PatsFanInPeace on Wed Nov 28, 2018 9:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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