Kirk Cousins is having an MVP season

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StumpHunter
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

Post by StumpHunter »

YikesVikes wrote: Sat Nov 17, 2018 4:41 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote: Fri Nov 16, 2018 10:48 am

Agreed 100%. I said this same thing when he signed. This happens with every franchise QB around the league. Joe Flacco was the highest paid QB back in 2011 (?). He's now 10th. Anytime a big time QB requires an extension, they end up passing whoever the current highest paid QB was. You're right, it's the going rate. I mean the Jets were ready to pay him $90 mill guaranteed. Wait until the Wentz's and Goff's get there. Or even Mahomes. They'll end up shattering Cousins.
People are acting like it's unheard of. Jimm G got 27. Stafford got 27. We paid 28. The guys that got 18 have real question marks that Kirk doesn't. Case as great as he was, had 1 season of play at a level that is the average for Cousins. We made the right choice and I would think the first half of the season would have been proof enough.
SF and Detroit are horribly run franchises. Let's do what they do.
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

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StumpHunter wrote: Sun Nov 18, 2018 11:16 pm
YikesVikes wrote: Sat Nov 17, 2018 4:41 pm

People are acting like it's unheard of. Jimm G got 27. Stafford got 27. We paid 28. The guys that got 18 have real question marks that Kirk doesn't. Case as great as he was, had 1 season of play at a level that is the average for Cousins. We made the right choice and I would think the first half of the season would have been proof enough.
SF and Detroit are horribly run franchises. Let's do what they do.
Are they horribly run. They've been to a superbowl in the 2000s. We haven't
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

Post by PurpleKoolaid »

This thread is a little funny.
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

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PurpleKoolaid wrote: Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:05 am This thread is a little funny.
Don't worry, people will be back in here saying "I told you so" after Cousins beats up on a bad GB defense. Cause that is what an MVP does, plays his best football against bad teams, and his worst against the best.
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

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Pondering Her Percy wrote: Fri Nov 16, 2018 10:48 am
YikesVikes wrote: Thu Nov 15, 2018 4:33 pm I wish people would stop complaining about the 84 million. It's the going rate for a QB. I am most upset about the length. 3 years puts him back on the market at an even higher rate in 3 years. We got a QB in his prime that has been exceptional. The alternatives were awful choices for a team on the cusp of a superbowl. We should be thanking the football gods we got him for 28.
Agreed 100%. I said this same thing when he signed. This happens with every franchise QB around the league. Joe Flacco was the highest paid QB back in 2011 (?). He's now 10th. Anytime a big time QB requires an extension, they end up passing whoever the current highest paid QB was. You're right, it's the going rate. I mean the Jets were ready to pay him $90 mill guaranteed. Wait until the Wentz's and Goff's get there. Or even Mahomes. They'll end up shattering Cousins.
Its reasons like this I feel theres should be a seperate cap for QBs. No other position demands that much money. Or have one player you give a large amount to regardless of positions and it doesn't count as part of the cap.
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

Post by J. Kapp 11 »

StumpHunter wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 3:32 pm
PurpleKoolaid wrote: Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:05 am This thread is a little funny.
Don't worry, people will be back in here saying "I told you so" after Cousins beats up on a bad GB defense. Cause that is what an MVP does, plays his best football against bad teams, and his worst against the best.
And don't worry ... if Cousins goes 30-for-31 for 600 yards and 8 touchdowns tonight, you'll be here to tell us how bad the one incompletion was.
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

J. Kapp 11 wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 6:18 pm
StumpHunter wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 3:32 pm
Don't worry, people will be back in here saying "I told you so" after Cousins beats up on a bad GB defense. Cause that is what an MVP does, plays his best football against bad teams, and his worst against the best.
And don't worry ... if Cousins goes 30-for-31 for 600 yards and 8 touchdowns tonight, you'll be here to tell us how bad the one incompletion was.
😂I literally laughed out loud at that
Last edited by Pondering Her Percy on Sun Nov 25, 2018 7:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

StumpHunter wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 3:32 pm
PurpleKoolaid wrote: Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:05 am This thread is a little funny.
Don't worry, people will be back in here saying "I told you so" after Cousins beats up on a bad GB defense. Cause that is what an MVP does, plays his best football against bad teams, and his worst against the best.
They currently have the 11th total defense in the nfl. Again, the chiefs defense is bad. GB is nowhere near that but way to cover your a$$ before the game starts
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

Post by PurpleMustReign »

Pondering Her Percy wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 7:36 pm
StumpHunter wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 3:32 pm
Don't worry, people will be back in here saying "I told you so" after Cousins beats up on a bad GB defense. Cause that is what an MVP does, plays his best football against bad teams, and his worst against the best.
They currently have the 11th total defense in the nfl. Again, the chiefs defense is bad. GB is nowhere near that but way to cover your a$$ before the game starts
Just remember stats don't tell the whole story. The Vikings defense, stats wise, was good last game. But on the first drive and then one later in the 3rd quarter they allowed Chicago to extend drives by not tackling properly and it cost them dearly. I get stats but they are just numbers. If they only allowed 50 yards of offense but allowed three 15 yard tds because of turnovers, it doesn't mean the will win the game.
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

Post by StumpHunter »

Pondering Her Percy wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 7:36 pm
StumpHunter wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 3:32 pm
Don't worry, people will be back in here saying "I told you so" after Cousins beats up on a bad GB defense. Cause that is what an MVP does, plays his best football against bad teams, and his worst against the best.
They currently have the 11th total defense in the nfl. Again, the chiefs defense is bad. GB is nowhere near that but way to cover your a$$ before the game starts
19th in passing YPA and opponent passer rating, 16th in points per game and drive. They are an average defense statistically, that is without two starters on the line and that traded away their best player in the secondary. A bad defense.

It isn't covering anything, it is predicting what people who foolishly said Cousins was having an MVP season despite the offense being bottom 10 will say when Cousins predictably plays well against little pass rush and a very young secondary.
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

StumpHunter wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 10:01 pm
Pondering Her Percy wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 7:36 pm

They currently have the 11th total defense in the nfl. Again, the chiefs defense is bad. GB is nowhere near that but way to cover your a$$ before the game starts
19th in passing YPA and opponent passer rating, 16th in points per game and drive. They are an average defense statistically, that is without two starters on the line and that traded away their best player in the secondary. A bad defense.

It isn't covering anything, it is predicting what people who foolishly said Cousins was having an MVP season despite the offense being bottom 10 will say when Cousins predictably plays well against little pass rush and a very young secondary.
Lol ok I think we’re passed the mvp season part. But you’re acting like he’s a bum. And that there were better options out there. And I would say you’re dead wrong there. And many others would agree. You must think he’s playing bad right now. And Rodgers is playing good right?
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

Post by StumpHunter »

Pondering Her Percy wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 10:21 pm

Lol ok I think we’re passed the mvp season part. But you’re acting like he’s a bum. And that there were better options out there. And I would say you’re dead wrong there. And many others would agree. You must think he’s playing bad right now. And Rodgers is playing good right?
I think it is nice to have a QB who is good enough to predictably beat up on bad teams. I also think getting the best QB in FA's isn't always a good move if the price is too high.

Just like trading for an oft injured, oft bad QB in Sam Bradford was not the right move in 2016, despite him being the best QB available. That first round pick could have turned into Mahomes or Watson, and instead it helped Philly win a SB.
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

StumpHunter wrote: Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:54 am
Pondering Her Percy wrote: Sun Nov 25, 2018 10:21 pm

Lol ok I think we’re passed the mvp season part. But you’re acting like he’s a bum. And that there were better options out there. And I would say you’re dead wrong there. And many others would agree. You must think he’s playing bad right now. And Rodgers is playing good right?
I think it is nice to have a QB who is good enough to predictably beat up on bad teams. I also think getting the best QB in FA's isn't always a good move if the price is too high.

Just like trading for an oft injured, oft bad QB in Sam Bradford was not the right move in 2016, despite him being the best QB available. That first round pick could have turned into Mahomes or Watson, and instead it helped Philly win a SB.
Helped Philly win the SB? They drafted Derek Barnett with our pick. He was a rotational player for them that year. Had 5 sacks on the year. Pretty sure that's not why they won the SB or had any barring on if they won or didnt that year.

And again, the price was high for Cousins but Keenum also proved this year he came back to reality. My point is, he wasnt a great choice either. And has been on of the WORST QBs in the league this year. Which is exactly what I was worried about. Zim said the same thing. He's been more inconsistent in his career than any other QB. But let's "try" that in the middle of a SB window. Players like Cousins hardly EVER hit FA. So if we gambled on Keenum and he came back to earth just like many thought, we would be stuck with him. Because there isnt another Kirk Cousins hitting FA.
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

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Pondering Her Percy wrote: Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:47 am Because there isnt another Kirk Cousins hitting FA.
I am cool with that. You draft your franchise QB, you don't buy him.

I didn't want Keenum long term. I thought he was an extremely limited QB who would regress if anything happened to one of his two elite receivers. I wanted Mahomes or Watson in 2017 if Teddy was really done, but since our GM screwed that up royally, I would go Teddy this year, draft pick next year if he didn't work out, or maybe even Keenum this year along with a draft pick this year or next, with Case filling in in the caretaker role.

Barnett strip sacked Keenum in the NFC Championship game I believe, and recovered the game winning fumble in the SB. They also used the other pick we sent to them on Ajayi, who played pretty well for them down the stretch. They might have won without those picks, but the picks they got certainly contributed, and not having them certainly hurt the Vikings.
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Re: Kirk Cousin is having an MVP season

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Pondering Her Percy wrote: Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:47 amKeenum also proved this year he came back to reality.
This isn't an argument for keeping Case but rather a defense of him. He was a class act when he was here, played well, and took part in one of the team's most historic plays. If he's not playing the Vikings I hope he does well.

Case hasn't done as well this year but he's not the type of QB that can elevate average players. That said, did you see any of the Broncos/Steelers game yesterday? Case actually looked really good. I saw at least two passes that were dropped by his receivers that Diggs and Thielen wouldn't have dropped. I'm talking 30-40 yard passes literally bouncing off of their hands Treadwell style. His stat line was 15/28 for 197 yards and 2TDs. If those were the Vikings receivers and running backs it would have been more like 20/28 for 300+ and 3TDs. That's speculation of course but if you don't believe me go back and watch, I think you'd agree.

Additionally, he was able to keep up his escape artist act. He was getting out of situations that it seemed like he shouldn't have. The Broncos also move the pocket around with him a lot and throw on the run.

Anyway, I think Case played really well against one of the better teams/defenses in the league yesterday. He doesn't have to be terrible to justify signing Cousins. The team can't count on <draft choice X> to pan out at QB when the team otherwise is ready to make a super bowl run and Case simply didn't have the credentials to take that risk either despite his good year.
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