Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

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ChicagoViking
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Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by ChicagoViking » Wed Sep 19, 2018 2:13 pm

Coming into this season, the Vikings primary QB options were Bradford, Keenum, Bridgewater, and Cousins (possibility they could have made a run at Brees, but seems unrealistic). Here is how they stack up after two games each:

Player.............Age......Salary.....Years....Comp.....Att.....PCT.....Yards....Yards/Att...Yards/GM.....TDs.....INTs....Rating....NFL Rank
Cousins..........30.........$28M........3..........55........84.......65.5.....669........8.0............334.5............6..........1.........108.7........6
Keenum..........30.........$18M........2..........44.......74........59.5.....551........7.4............275.5...........3...........4..........73.6........28
Bradford..........30.........$20M.......1...........37.......61........60.7.....243........4.0............121.5...........0..........2...........55.6........32
Bridgewater.....25...........$6M.......1............0.........0..........0...........0...........0................0................0...........0............0............0

While it is WAY too early to draw any conclusions, so far Cousins is the clear winner with Bridgewater getting an incomplete. Even at $10M more than Keenum and $8M more than Bradford, the early results suggest the Vikes made the right choice.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by mansquatch » Wed Sep 19, 2018 2:29 pm

I have a feeling this comparison will become fairly irrelevant by week 8. Unless something amazing happens with one of the other three.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by StumpHunter » Wed Sep 19, 2018 5:54 pm

Cousins was brought in to win more games and go further in the playoffs than the Vikings could have with Case or some other backup QB.

I would expect Cousins to throw for more TDs and yards with the weapons he has. DT and Sanders aren't exactly slouches, but the Vikings are significantly better on offense outside of the QB spot. In other words, pure production won't be the deciding factor on whether Cousins was worth the 10 million more per year to sign.

So instead of production, the question to ask is whether we would be 1-0-1 with Case at QB, 0-2, 2-0 or 1-1? To me, it isn't all that clear. Sure Case wouldn't have made some of the big throws Cousins did in the second half of Sunday's game, but he would have been better at avoiding the pressure that slowed the offense in the first half. Maybe instead of that sack before the blocked punt, Case converts on 3rd down and we don't need heroics in the 4th.

Or maybe Case stinks as much in the first half for the Vikings as he did for the Broncos and we lose 29-3.

Bradford on the other hand, is worse in the pocket than Cousins AND is not as good a pure passer. Turns out he isn't a very good QB. Who knew?

Teddy will probably end up making Vikings fans very sad when he wins a couple of SBs with NOs, but I understand not wanting to take a risk on him. Zimmer and Rick's jobs were on the line and they went with the sure thing over the high risk, high reward Teddy Bridgewater.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by ChicagoViking » Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:50 pm

StumpHunter wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 5:54 pm
Teddy will probably end up making Vikings fans very sad when he wins a couple of SBs with NOs, but I understand not wanting to take a risk on him. Zimmer and Rick's jobs were on the line and they went with the sure thing over the high risk, high reward Teddy Bridgewater.
Teddy is under contract for only one year. Who knows where he'll be next year or the following year? Maybe he'll be back in purple in time to back up Cousins in the final year of his contract . . . .
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by ChicagoViking » Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:59 pm

StumpHunter wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 5:54 pm
I would expect Cousins to throw for more TDs and yards with the weapons he has. DT and Sanders aren't exactly slouches, but the Vikings are significantly better on offense outside of the QB spot. In other words, pure production won't be the deciding factor on whether Cousins was worth the 10 million more per year to sign.

So instead of production, the question to ask is whether we would be 1-0-1 with Case at QB, 0-2, 2-0 or 1-1? To me, it isn't all that clear. Sure Case wouldn't have made some of the big throws Cousins did in the second half of Sunday's game, but he would have been better at avoiding the pressure that slowed the offense in the first half. Maybe instead of that sack before the blocked punt, Case converts on 3rd down and we don't need heroics in the 4th.
A couple of things: Great QBs seem to perform even without great teams around them. Witness what Rodgers and Brady have done during years when the teams around them just weren't very good. Even Cousins during his years in Washington with virtually no help was far better than Keenum and Bradford have looked in early play this season.

And of course the question ultimately is how far will Cousins take the Vikings compared to what the other options could have done, but there is no way to really know that. All I can say is that so far it does not seem that Keenum and Bradford have elevated the play of their teams; Cousins has.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by 808vikingsfan » Thu Sep 20, 2018 12:13 am

ChicagoViking wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:59 pm
A couple of things: Great QBs seem to perform even without great teams around them. Witness what Rodgers and Brady have done during years when the teams around them just weren't very good. Even Cousins during his years in Washington with virtually no help was far better than Keenum and Bradford have looked in early play this season.

And of course the question ultimately is how far will Cousins take the Vikings compared to what the other options could have done, but there is no way to really know that. All I can say is that so far it does not seem that Keenum and Bradford have elevated the play of their teams; Cousins has.
I have to disagree about Keenum. For a team that only won 5 games last season, Case has led the Broncos to a 2-0 record this season, mounting a game winning drive last week against the Raiders. Keenum makes mistakes, but he makes plays.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by PacificNorseWest » Thu Sep 20, 2018 12:17 am

Keenum is a baller.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by StumpHunter » Thu Sep 20, 2018 6:36 am

ChicagoViking wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:50 pm
Teddy is under contract for only one year. Who knows where he'll be next year or the following year? Maybe he'll be back in purple in time to back up Cousins in the final year of his contract . . . .
Seems unlikely. Some team will need a starter next season and not be drafting high enough to get one that way. Outside of Teddy, there arent going to be a lot of other options.

Plus, I think NO might already have him in their plans for the future based the restructured contract. That is a lot of dead cap space they are going to be hit with if he leaves. Too much for just a backup, imo.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by StumpHunter » Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:06 am

ChicagoViking wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:59 pm

And of course the question ultimately is how far will Cousins take the Vikings compared to what the other options could have done, but there is no way to really know that. All I can say is that so far it does not seem that Keenum and Bradford have elevated the play of their teams; Cousins has.
The thing is, Cousins hasn’t really elevated the team yet. 18th in offensive points per drive (1.8), 13th in yards (32.12) compared to 8th (2.11) and 8th (32.73) in 2017. The offense should be better this year, our RBs are better and Cousins is a better passer than Case will ever be, there just isn’t a lot to improve on over last year.

Also, Denver’s offense through 2 games is actually much better than the Vikings, minus the interceptions, and you can’t really deny that Case has elevated that team. 1.96 pts per drive(14th) and 34.58 yards(8th) is significantly better than what Denver did last year when they were the 29th worst scoring offense. Of course, those picks are really hurting the Broncos, and I don’t know if those will go away if they keep asking Case to run a pro-style offense.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by ChicagoViking » Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:23 am

StumpHunter wrote:
Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:06 am
The thing is, Cousins hasn’t really elevated the team yet. 18th in offensive points per drive (1.8), 13th in yards (32.12) compared to 8th (2.11) and 8th (32.73) in 2017. The offense should be better this year, our RBs are better and Cousins is a better passer than Case will ever be, there just isn’t a lot to improve on over last year.

Also, Denver’s offense through 2 games is actually much better than the Vikings, minus the interceptions, and you can’t really deny that Case has elevated that team. 1.96 pts per drive(14th) and 34.58 yards(8th) is significantly better than what Denver did last year when they were the 29th worst scoring offense. Of course, those picks are really hurting the Broncos, and I don’t know if those will go away if they keep asking Case to run a pro-style offense.
Cousins elevating the team: really hard to say given that they have played only two games and it is difficult to know just how strong the defenses are of the Niners and GB. All I can say is that I don't think there is any way Keenum could have led the Vikes to that comeback against GB.

Denver's offense: the key language is "minus the interceptions." Um. Yeah.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by StumpHunter » Thu Sep 20, 2018 11:36 am

ChicagoViking wrote:
Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:23 am
Cousins elevating the team: really hard to say given that they have played only two games and it is difficult to know just how strong the defenses are of the Niners and GB. All I can say is that I don't think there is any way Keenum could have led the Vikes to that comeback against GB.

Denver's offense: the key language is "minus the interceptions." Um. Yeah.
Totally agree, those picks are the reason we moved on from Case. I wish they had an interceptable pass stat, because he threw a lot that weren't picked last year.

I do question the Niners and GB's defense being good though. They might be good, but in a small sample size, GB's corners are young and bad at this point and the Niners just gave up 27 to the Lions and were really bad last year. At this point I would say both are below average at best.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by 808vikingsfan » Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:03 am

I think the Jets are regretting letting Bridgewater go right now. Darnold has been pretty bad. Shouldn't be starting.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by StumpHunter » Fri Sep 21, 2018 7:59 am

808vikingsfan wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:03 am
I think the Jets are regretting letting Bridgewater go right now. Darnold has been pretty bad. Shouldn't be starting.
The possibility of Darnold struggling is the reason they let Bridgewater go. That locker room would be a disaster right now if Teddy was sitting there ready to go while Darnold stunk it up. I bet even with Mccoun there is talk among the players on the Jets about why they have to waste a season of their careers while Darnold figures out how to be an NFL QB. With Teddy it would be ten times worse.

There is a reason teams pick guys like Bradford, Cassel, Taylor and Mcnabb to mentor young QBs and start before their rookies. When those guys are benched, and the rookie comes in making rookie mistakes, people are more forgiving because at least it isn't their washed up predecessor.

Imagine if Teddy played well all season for the Jets, got 25 million per year to start somewhere else in the offseason, and then Darnold struggled in his first year starting, as first year starters are want to do. That would not be good for the team, the fans, or the young QB's confidence.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by 808vikingsfan » Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:13 pm

StumpHunter wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 7:59 am
The possibility of Darnold struggling is the reason they let Bridgewater go. That locker room would be a disaster right now if Teddy was sitting there ready to go while Darnold stunk it up. I bet even with Mccoun there is talk among the players on the Jets about why they have to waste a season of their careers while Darnold figures out how to be an NFL QB. With Teddy it would be ten times worse.

There is a reason teams pick guys like Bradford, Cassel, Taylor and Mcnabb to mentor young QBs and start before their rookies. When those guys are benched, and the rookie comes in making rookie mistakes, people are more forgiving because at least it isn't their washed up predecessor.

Imagine if Teddy played well all season for the Jets, got 25 million per year to start somewhere else in the offseason, and then Darnold struggled in his first year starting, as first year starters are want to do. That would not be good for the team, the fans, or the young QB's confidence.
If the Jets started Teddy, they might be 3-0 right now. Let Darnold watch and learn, worry about peoples feelings later. Winning cures everything.
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Re: Viking QB Options 2018: Tracker

Post by FullWood » Sat Sep 22, 2018 7:29 pm

StumpHunter wrote:
Thu Sep 20, 2018 11:36 am
Totally agree, those picks are the reason we moved on from Case. I wish they had an interceptable pass stat, because he threw a lot that weren't picked last year.

I do question the Niners and GB's defense being good though. They might be good, but in a small sample size, GB's corners are young and bad at this point and the Niners just gave up 27 to the Lions and were really bad last year. At this point I would say both are below average at best.
I agree too and Kirk 1 pick was due to Treadwell fault. I like Case and cheering for him but I don't believe we win or tie in GB with him.
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