Brian O'Neil surprises

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YikesVikes
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Re: Brian O'Neil surprises

Post by YikesVikes » Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:32 pm

dead_poet wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:20 pm
No.



Why is run blocking all that different at guard than at tackle?
Guards sometimes must take on a Nose Tackle by themselves depending on the play. At the very least, a DT. They are also expected to get to the 2nd level and pull. However, at RT, you are often singled up with a LDE (the bigger DE in most 4-3 schemes) or an OLB. Most of these guys are 250 to 285. Compare that to DTs that are 290 to 330. On the outside, TEs tend to do more of the chipping and getting to the 2nd level. 2 different skillsets.
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Pondering Her Percy
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Re: Brian O'Neil surprises

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:55 pm

YikesVikes wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:37 pm
Run blocking will still be an issue on his side. up the middle should be better and running to the left. Remmers and him are poor at it.

I would feel even better with
Reiff, Herandez, Elfein, Jones, Remmers
I also didn't miss that the Packers 2nd round corner scored this week while looking solid.
Listen we know you’re still upset over the whole Hernandez thing but it was a special teams TD. A blocked punt that happen to fall into his hands. Anyone can score on special teams. Especially the way he did. Doesn’t necessarily mean he was a good pick. And Diggs and Thielen dominated everyone in the GB secondary. So to be honest, none of them looked “solid”.

Mike Hughes got a pick 6 last week and put us up by 2 scores which essentially sealed the deal. That’s scoring and looking solid IMO. And O’Neill did his part as well. I’m still very much in favor of who we drafted
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Re: Brian O'Neil surprises

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:01 pm

YikesVikes wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:41 pm
Nope. He moves well coming in at the end of the game, vs a guy who probably didn't know much about him while he was armed with game film about the guys tendencies. He had almost every advantage in the book. I still do not like how he deals with bull rushes. This is the NFL and defenses are going to set you up once they know you have a deficiency. Play him this week and pray Hill gets back soon.
Again I feel like you’re beating around the bush digging for reasons to say Spielman should’ve took Hernandez. What makes you think Hill is better than O’Neill right now? Did you watch the Philly game last year? Hill gets owned against speed rushers. Which you see more off the edge than bull rushers. We have an $84 million quarterback back there, I take a guy that can stick with speed rushers any day over a guy that’s strong but has horribly slow feet. I don’t “hope Hill gets back soon” until O’Neill proves he can’t withstand right tackle. But from what I saw, he held up quite well. Whether the guy he was facing saw film on him or not
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Re: Brian O'Neil surprises

Post by VikingLord » Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:05 pm

O'Neil did well when pressed into significant duty. I think we can all agree on that. It is also not an easy thing for a rookie at any position to come in like that in a hostile, pressure environment on the road and stay calm and focused and do his job (witness place kicker Carlson...).

Yes, he's going to go through some growing pains this year if he remains out there. Some of his success could be due to a lack of tape on him. But he looked well prepared physically and, more importantly, mentally, and I'd say the odds of him failing spectacularly at any point in the future this year have been greatly diminished by his performance this past Sunday whether he starts the next game or not.

The best thing about O'Neil is his ability to move in space. He's an athletic guy. He is perfect for a zone blocking scheme and will be best against speed rushers coming off the edge. He can read the pass rush schemes and can get into the right spots. He fits well with what the 2018 Vikings want on their offensive line. Hernandez, or someone else the Vikings could have taken in the 1st, might ultimately still prove to be a better choice, but I think the O'Neil choice will ultimately prove to be a great one by Spielman.
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Re: Brian O'Neil surprises

Post by YikesVikes » Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:25 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:01 pm
Again I feel like you’re beating around the bush digging for reasons to say Spielman should’ve took Hernandez. What makes you think Hill is better than O’Neill right now? Did you watch the Philly game last year? Hill gets owned against speed rushers. Which you see more off the edge than bull rushers. We have an $84 million quarterback back there, I take a guy that can stick with speed rushers any day over a guy that’s strong but has horribly slow feet. I don’t “hope Hill gets back soon” until O’Neill proves he can’t withstand right tackle. But from what I saw, he held up quite well. Whether the guy he was facing saw film on him or not
You are only focused on passing. He isn't close to Hill in the run game. You have to consider both. Also, as I pointed out, Guys rushing O'neil had almost no film on him if any. He had film on them. This early success may vanish as his tendencies are captured on film. Add to that that he was fresh and the other guys tired in an early season game ( despite GB holding the ball for 12 mins in final quarter). Don't crown him better just yet.
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Re: Brian O'Neil surprises

Post by dead_poet » Wed Sep 19, 2018 7:52 am

That's disconcerting. Hill is weaker in the run game than pass, usually.

Related: podcast talking O-line play with former lineman Sirles. Pretty interesting: http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/1500espn ... eb8400.mp3
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Re: Brian O'Neil surprises

Post by Cliff » Wed Sep 19, 2018 8:39 am

EAGAN, Minn. — Brian O’Neill made his NFL debut on Sunday, playing 32 snaps at historic Lambeau Field as the Vikings earned a 29-29 tie with Green Bay.

It was certainly a long way from the college game, or even where the Vikings rookie right tackle was a few months ago in spring practices.

O’Neill said after Sunday’s game that he would have to watch the game back to truly evaluate his performance. But the initial impression was positive.

”First thoughts, yeah, I thought I came a long way,” O’Neill said. “But there’s still miles to go.

“I have so many million details I have to worry about to get better and try and improve,” O’Neill said.

Vikings Head Coach Mike Zimmer on Monday said he liked what he saw from the 2017 second-round draft pick out of Pittsburgh.

“Yeah, he did pretty good,” Zimmer said. “I thought he played well.”
Read more
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Re: Brian O'Neil surprises

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Wed Sep 19, 2018 11:18 am

YikesVikes wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:25 pm
You are only focused on passing. He isn't close to Hill in the run game. You have to consider both. Also, as I pointed out, Guys rushing O'neil had almost no film on him if any. He had film on them. This early success may vanish as his tendencies are captured on film. Add to that that he was fresh and the other guys tired in an early season game ( despite GB holding the ball for 12 mins in final quarter). Don't crown him better just yet.
I am considering the run game. Hill is decent in the run but not good vs. the pass. ONeill, is better in the pass but (maybe) not as good in the run (saying maybe because we didnt run enough to say so when he was in). Point is, would you rather have a RT that is bad in pass pro but good in run OR good in pass pro and below average (again maybe) in the run?? I take the latter any day of the week. I take a weak run blocker but solid pass protector over a mauler in the run.

Because, (knock on wood) if we lose our $84 million QB for the year, we're screwed. Sorry but Siemien isnt going on the run Keenum did. If we lost Dalvin Cook because ONeill got blown backwards, we can still survive. Neither is a good situation but you have to protect your QB first and foremost. Especially one of Cousins caliber. That is why I'm starting to think O'Neill is the better bet. If Hill gets any kind of legit speed rusher hauling a$s at him, Cousins is going to be night night. ONeill can keep up with that. He's just an overall better athlete
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Re: Brian O'Neil surprises

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Wed Sep 19, 2018 11:20 am

dead_poet wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 7:52 am
That's disconcerting. Hill is weaker in the run game than pass, usually.

Related: podcast talking O-line play with former lineman Sirles. Pretty interesting: http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/1500espn ... eb8400.mp3
All I know is that his pass protection against Philly (and others throughout the year) gave me nightmares
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Re: Brian O'Neil surprises

Post by dead_poet » Wed Sep 19, 2018 12:37 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 11:20 am
All I know is that his pass protection against Philly (and others throughout the year) gave me nightmares
I'm not sure any offensive lineman (or Vikings player period) showed up against Philly. I thought he held up most of the time OK (in the pass game). We can certainly use an upgrade if we can find one. Hopefully O'Neil is that guy in the near-future. And decidedly better.
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