Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

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Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by fiestavike » Wed Aug 22, 2018 10:33 am

First, Rashod Hill, T

At 630,000 for 2018, Rashod Hill is a bargain for a borderline starting caliber RT. So why would we consider trading him? First, Brian O'Neill might be ahead of him in the competition for the RT spot. Once Remmers is healthy, he might be the best RT on the roster, and the position flexibility of Aviante Collins means he's the more likely candidate to suit up on game days if Hill does indeed find himself 2nd/3rd on the depth chart at RT. Additionally, Rashod Hill is NOT under contract for 2019 and with only 6 million in cap space currently available, its VERY UNLIKELY the Vikings prioritize signing Hill. He's probably gone after this season either way. Yet another compelling reason to consider trading Hill is that he might actually have significant trade value. He is not your normal top end camp cut who might fetch a 7th rounder. He is a guy who has played competently at RT in the NFL and still has room to improve. Particularly a team that suffers an injury at RT might be willing to cough up a pretty solid asset in return for Rashod Hill.

Second, Latavius Murry, RB

Murray is also in his last year with the Vikings. He's making 5.2, which could be valuable cap space if the Vikings are going to try to keep Anthony Barr. Murray has great size and acceleration, but is terrible after contact. On the whole, he's not without value, but he's also not elite. The Vikings have two young runners who may provide greater flexibility and scheme fit, and even more physicality in Thomas and Boone. Murray would have some value. Probably getting a 4th is unrealistic, but a 5th or pair of 6th rounders might be an option. Stockpiling those picks is going to matter a great deal as the Vikings come up against the salary cap for the first time in recent memory. Inexpensive players on rookie contracts are going to have to develop and play well. That means taking lots of bites at the apple. In short, the team likely isn't worse off without Murray this year, has better long term prospects in house, and can use both the cap space and the draft resources to better position the team for long term success.

Third, Trae Waynes, CB

Of course, there is a strong case to be made for keeping Waynes. Chief among them is the cliche, "you can never have enough CBs". That's probably true. The early hopes for Holton Hill might have been too optimistic (although he's still a nice prospect), but Horace Richardson, Marcus Sherels and Terrence Newman all seem capable of contributing in different ways. Clearly, there would be a risk in making this trade should Alexander, Hughes, or Rhodes go down. But there would also be a risk in NOT making this trade.

Trae Waynes is currently making just over 4 million, but next year he is slated to make 9 million with 0 guaranteed except for injury in 2019 on his 5th year option. Its very unlikely that Trae Waynes plays out that last year of his deal--and the Vikings could cut or trade him then--but should he be injured, an already tight cap situation becomes very costly! Getting out from under that possibility now, and getting something valuable in return might be a cautious and prudent decision.

While Trae Waynes has improved during his tenure with the team, he is not an elite player. He is weak against the slant route, and often picked on by opposing QBs. Every player has their weaknesses, and Waynes strengths are also worth noting, he's a willing tackler despite his size, had great recovery speed, and excellent long speed. Overall he is a good player, which means...

...Trae Waynes has value. Particularly in the case of an injury, I could see Waynes fetching a 2nd round pick. He'd likely bring a third in compensatory picks if he played out his deal and walked, but that wouldn't be an asset the Vikings could cash in on until 2021.
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by fiestavike » Wed Aug 22, 2018 10:34 am

I'd love to hear from others what players they might envision being traded, be it bottom of the roster guys or 'surprise' trades.
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by PurpleMustReign » Wed Aug 22, 2018 11:34 am

Wayne's is definitely a possibility. I don't think they will trade Murray unless they are 1,000% sure Cooks knee is ok.
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by PacificNorseWest » Wed Aug 22, 2018 11:41 am

Trade an OL and a your backup RB...Don't like it.
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by fiestavike » Wed Aug 22, 2018 11:46 am

PacificNorseWest wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 11:41 am
Trade an OL and a your backup RB...Don't like it.
But an offensive lineman who is probably 3rd on the depth chart at his position, in the last year of his deal, who won't suit up all season barring injury, and who has trade value.

Re: Murray, you still have two at least comparable backup running backs.
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by mansquatch » Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:13 pm

The backup RB are not comparable to Murray. Murray has playoff experience, is an NFL veteran and has shown he can perform at a high level. The backups have shown... nothing. Also, what would we get for him. Is it likely we see something that would be a net addition to our OL situation? Seems doubtful.

The biggest issue on the OL is depth, seems like trading Hill to add OL is replacing one problem with another, one which likely includes more unknowns than keeping Hill. This move would be HIGHLY dependent on scouting reports on the guy you get on the other side of the deal. Also, not to be undervalued, Hill has 2 years with the organization and his OL teammates. IMO, this is a bad deal. Would make us worse in the short term.

Waynes: This could net us something that might be a reasonable asset in return, but i think people are underestimated how important Waynes is to the club. Waynes plays outside corner where Hughes and Alexander mostly play at Slot. If we give him up we get shorter on the outside and are starting guys with less experience unless we put Newman back out there. In a season where we are basically saying "Superbowl or bust" this seems like a bad idea. Again, what do we get in return for him?

Of all the moves Waynes probably hurts the least, but it would be highly dependent on what kind of compensation comes on the backside of the deal. I'm not sure any of these trades would make us better.
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by fiestavike » Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:31 pm

mansquatch wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:13 pm
The backup RB are not comparable to Murray. Murray has playoff experience, is an NFL veteran and has shown he can perform at a high level. The backups have shown... nothing. Also, what would we get for him. Is it likely we see something that would be a net addition to our OL situation? Seems doubtful.

The biggest issue on the OL is depth, seems like trading Hill to add OL is replacing one problem with another, one which likely includes more unknowns than keeping Hill. This move would be HIGHLY dependent on scouting reports on the guy you get on the other side of the deal. Also, not to be undervalued, Hill has 2 years with the organization and his OL teammates. IMO, this is a bad deal. Would make us worse in the short term.

Waynes: This could net us something that might be a reasonable asset in return, but i think people are underestimated how important Waynes is to the club. Waynes plays outside corner where Hughes and Alexander mostly play at Slot. If we give him up we get shorter on the outside and are starting guys with less experience unless we put Newman back out there. In a season where we are basically saying "Superbowl or bust" this seems like a bad idea. Again, what do we get in return for him?

Of all the moves Waynes probably hurts the least, but it would be highly dependent on what kind of compensation comes on the backside of the deal. I'm not sure any of these trades would make us better.
Interesting. I see the Waynes trade as hurting the most (or at least potentially hurting the most while bringing the greatest return) whereas the Murray and Hill trades would likely be unnoticeable in terms of production unless we had at least two injuries at their given positions. I wouldn't envision trading for players in these cases...picks would be more likely although either could be moved for a G/C (or Hill's roster spot could be used to sign a G/C released by another team).

If Hill could play Guard I don't think there is a chance they would trade him, its just that his lack of position flexibility makes him a guy who won't dress unless he wins the job. This versatility and a little bit of dead money is the only home I see for Mike Remmers to stick with the club in 2019, and also the thing that makes it inconceivable the team would move on from him this season. Hill just isn't likely to play at all unless O'Neill and Remmers get injured. Even then, Aviante Collins might be the prefered RT given his rapid improvement and contractual future with the team.
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by autobon7 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:12 pm

Could prolly add Sendejo to that list now.
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by fiestavike » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:29 pm

autobon7 wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:12 pm
Could prolly add Sendejo to that list now.
It is possible. Cowboys fans seem very thirsty for a S. They had interest in Iloka. But how much will they trade for a guy slated to make 5.5 next year? What do you think might be realistic and would it be worth making the trade?

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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by halfgiz » Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:15 pm

Anthony Harris could possibly be someone to trade. He has experience...
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by fiestavike » Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:44 pm

halfgiz wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:15 pm
Anthony Harris could possibly be someone to trade. He has experience...
Not a bad option. If you trade Harris and have Sendejo a cap casualty next year and Iloka not under contract, you could have a lot of turnover at safety, but I'd be fine with trading Harris.
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by S197 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:04 pm

Hill is the starting RT, O'Neill needs time to build strength. I also think he's likely Reiff's backup, he's probably the best swing tackle on the team. Collins didn't really fare all that well at RT against Jacksonville.

We need Murray and he was very productive last year. Dalvin fell in the draft because of injury concerns and there's nothing right now to show those concerns weren't valid. I think he will be amazing if he can stay on the field but that's still a big "if." Murray already reduced his contract to be more team friendly, I don't like the decision of shipping him.

Sendejo might be a candidate, especially with the new rules, but it really depends on the trade. I think the Vikings are pretty much stuck, the right way to do it was grab a lineman early on a team friendly rookie contract. There are no good options left.
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by fiestavike » Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:39 pm

S197 wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:04 pm
Hill is the starting RT, O'Neill needs time to build strength. I also think he's likely Reiff's backup, he's probably the best swing tackle on the team. Collins didn't really fare all that well at RT against Jacksonville.

We need Murray and he was very productive last year. Dalvin fell in the draft because of injury concerns and there's nothing right now to show those concerns weren't valid. I think he will be amazing if he can stay on the field but that's still a big "if." Murray already reduced his contract to be more team friendly, I don't like the decision of shipping him.

Sendejo might be a candidate, especially with the new rules, but it really depends on the trade. I think the Vikings are pretty much stuck, the right way to do it was grab a lineman early on a team friendly rookie contract. There are no good options left.
Have to disagree with your analysis of Collins at RT.

Its certainly one narrative that Hill will start at RT because O'Neill needs to get stronger. That is reinforced on a pre-season depth chart, but so far it has looked not to be an accurate narrative.

If you assume that Remmers or O'Neill will be starting at RT, would that change your opinion on the notion of trading Hill? Do you agree that if O'Neill starts at RT, Remmers at G, that Collins is much more likely to suit up than Hill as one of only 7 active linemen?
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by VikingLord » Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:48 pm

If Spielman feels the need to make a move along the OL, I don't see him doing it with a player trade. He'd likely give up a draft pick or two depending on the quality of the player.

I'm still hopeful the cutdowns produce some solid vet options, at least for depth.
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Re: Three Surprising Trade Scenarios The Vikings Should Consider.

Post by S197 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 6:40 pm

fiestavike wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:39 pm
Have to disagree with your analysis of Collins at RT.

Its certainly one narrative that Hill will start at RT because O'Neill needs to get stronger. That is reinforced on a pre-season depth chart, but so far it has looked not to be an accurate narrative.

If you assume that Remmers or O'Neill will be starting at RT, would that change your opinion on the notion of trading Hill? Do you agree that if O'Neill starts at RT, Remmers at G, that Collins is much more likely to suit up than Hill as one of only 7 active linemen?
It depends on who they think has the most flexibility. If O'Neill starts and were to go down, it's possible they could move Remmers back to tackle. But relying on Collins is a pretty big gamble, I don't think the know where he fits in best quite yet. He played the whole game against JAX, started at RT, then LT with the 2's, then G with the 3's.
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