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 Time to move on from Waynes 
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Post Time to move on from Waynes
I have been championing the Vikes moving on from Waynes a long time. His instincts are horrible, his play speed is terrible and he is easily beaten. I think he has tons of natural talent that he simply doesn't use. I do not believe that he has the heart to be a starter for this team and until we move on from him, he's going to continue to get beat like a rug in a preschool snack area (dirty). He's under contract but this team needs to make a run at a corner to stabilize that left side. We have a huge need at NT and I would like us to go after WIll Hernandez (OG UTEP) in the draft but.... I can't tak another season of him getting beat, the WR dropping the ball and him celebrating like he made the play.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:10 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
He started off slow this season again, and i was ready for us to move away. But to be honest, i thought he was very solid towards the end of the season and the saints game (no one was good in the eagles game).
He used to drive me crazy, when he kept his eyes on the player and kept drawing PI calls. But he's learnt to get his head round. And especially for the Saints game, when Rhodes was throwing his weekly tantrum, i was hoping Zim would of made the adjustment and put Trae on Thomas. As Rhodes couldn't keep up with Thomas.
I was a big critic before, and it's taken him a while, but I think i'm slowly becoming a believer. I believe we could possibly have one of the best CB tandems in the game on our hands.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:29 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
YikesVikes wrote:
I have been championing the Vikes moving on from Waynes a long time. His instincts are horrible, his play speed is terrible and he is easily beaten. I think he has tons of natural talent that he simply doesn't use. I do not believe that he has the heart to be a starter for this team and until we move on from him, he's going to continue to get beat like a rug in a preschool snack area (dirty). He's under contract but this team needs to make a run at a corner to stabilize that left side. We have a huge need at NT and I would like us to go after WIll Hernandez (OG UTEP) in the draft but.... I can't tak another season of him getting beat, the WR dropping the ball and him celebrating like he made the play.


Dude what are you talking about? He made giant improvements this year and was unreal in run defense. He barely gave up anything the last half of the year. Rhodes was getting beat more than he was. We do not need to make a “run at corner”. We have two very good starters.

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:47 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
Waynes should not be the focus of our disappointment. Yes he had his ups and downs but basically every corner does. This is a passing league and just look at the stats across the NFL. If every team got rid of DB's that gave up plays there wouldn't be any DB's in the NFL!! He played fine on one of the best defenses in the NFL and there was talk during the games that the vikes had one of the best CB tandems in the league. The vikes need to improve their pass rush, once that happens the DB's will look even better.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:47 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
Where is the head-slap emoji.

Never mind. I'll use this one. :wallbang:

Waynes finished the season with a PFF grade of 79.1, which is 9th best in the NFL.

Give it a rest.

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:51 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
What Trae Waynes have you been watching? Between he and Sendejo, I am not sure who improved more.

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 8:08 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Where is the head-slap emoji.

Never mind. I'll use this one. :wallbang:

Waynes finished the season with a PFF grade of 79.1, which is 9th best in the NFL.

Give it a rest.


I was curious as to what his PFF grade was. Thank you for that stat Kapp

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 8:30 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
PurpleMustReign wrote:
What Trae Waynes have you been watching? Between he and Sendejo, I am not sure who improved more.

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Exactly. Both made giant leaps this year. Waynes run defense reminds me a lot of Winfield. But like I said above, his coverage was probably better than Rhodes the last half of the year. And yeah Waynes got beat a few times in the Eagles game but so did Harrison Smith, so did Newman, Rhodes play was up and down. So really, that cant be used as an excuse in this. Trae Waynes is a very good #2 CB. One of the better ones in the league right now

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 8:32 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
I think he started typing out this post in week 1 and just now finished.

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 8:59 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Where is the head-slap emoji.

Never mind. I'll use this one. :wallbang:

Waynes finished the season with a PFF grade of 79.1, which is 9th best in the NFL.

Give it a rest.


Umm yeah, did the OP watch any of the games?

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:37 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
Wayne's is probably one of the better tacklers on our team. He had a solid second half of the season.
He didn't have a great game against the Eagles...but most of the defense didn't have a great game.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 10:29 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
Cliff wrote:
I think he started typing out this post in week 1 and just now finished.


:lol: :lol: :lol:

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:02 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
I thought Waynes took the next step forward in 2017 and he'll have a chance to make another leap in 2018 seeing as it's the final year of his rookie contract (unless we pick up his 5th year option).

PFF grades

2015 - 72.6
2016 - 59.9 (Substantial drop but this is where Rhodes really broke to the rest of the world as a shut down corner and Waynes started getting picked on because QB's would avoid Rhodes)
2017 - 74.2

For comparison sake here is Rhodes PFF grades over his career

2013 - 78
2014 - 83.4
2015 - 65.6
2016 - 78.6
2017 - 81.1

In coverage for corners with 1,000 or more snaps this season he ranks very very similar to Trumaine Johnson of LAR. In fact here is a side by side between Waynes and Johnson.

Overall Grade
Waynes - 74.2
Johnson - 74.2

Coverage and snaps
Waynes - 71.2 - 667
Johnson - 75.4 - 645

Run Def and snaps
Waynes - 84.9 - 377
Johnson - 77.5 - 360

2017 Cap Number
Trumaine Johnson - $16,742,400 (Contract year)
Trae Waynes - $3,530,281 (not a contract year)

Only 26 CB's had 1,000 or more snaps - Rhodes and Waynes both included in that 26

I'd say we had tremendous value with Waynes this year and I believe he still has capacity for improvement and he is in the perfect situation to develop into a stud opposite Rhodes.

We do however, need to figure out our slot corner situation

Newman played lights out for his age and position but at some point we need a replacement and Mack Alexander has one of the worst PFF overall and coverage ratings - luckily, if in a bind, I think we can find that in free agency and it won't cost $16 million against the cap. Hopefully Mack can make a leap in 2018.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:22 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
PhillyVike wrote:
I thought Waynes took the next step forward in 2017 and he'll have a chance to make another leap in 2018 seeing as it's the final year of his rookie contract (unless we pick up his 5th year option).

PFF grades

2015 - 72.6
2016 - 59.9 (Substantial drop but this is where Rhodes really broke to the rest of the world as a shut down corner and Waynes started getting picked on because QB's would avoid Rhodes)
2017 - 74.2

For comparison sake here is Rhodes PFF grades over his career

2013 - 78
2014 - 83.4
2015 - 65.6
2016 - 78.6
2017 - 81.1

In coverage for corners with 1,000 or more snaps this season he ranks very very similar to Trumaine Johnson of LAR. In fact here is a side by side between Waynes and Johnson.

Overall Grade
Waynes - 74.2
Johnson - 74.2

Coverage and snaps
Waynes - 71.2 - 667
Johnson - 75.4 - 645

Run Def and snaps
Waynes - 84.9 - 377
Johnson - 77.5 - 360

2017 Cap Number
Trumaine Johnson - $16,742,400 (Contract year)
Trae Waynes - $3,530,281 (not a contract year)

Only 26 CB's had 1,000 or more snaps - Rhodes and Waynes both included in that 26

I'd say we had tremendous value with Waynes this year and I believe he still has capacity for improvement and he is in the perfect situation to develop into a stud opposite Rhodes.

We do however, need to figure out our slot corner situation

Newman played lights out for his age and position but at some point we need a replacement and Mack Alexander has one of the worst PFF overall and coverage ratings - luckily, if in a bind, I think we can find that in free agency and it won't cost $16 million against the cap. Hopefully Mack can make a leap in 2018.


Good post!

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:29 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
Did you mean Alexander? Because I'd say is the most improved player on the team. He has been good against the run since he started playing, and now he is good in coverage. We may have to move on from Newman and thats going to suck.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:41 pm
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
Way way better pass rush is what this defense needs most. Look at the games we lost and see, the pass rush was barely there


Thu Feb 01, 2018 1:02 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
Agreed, definitely pass rush. We need an aggressive John Randle type player next to Linval Joseph.

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Thu Feb 01, 2018 2:34 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
PurpleKoolaid wrote:
Did you mean Alexander? Because I'd say is the most improved player on the team. He has been good against the run since he started playing, and now he is good in coverage. We may have to move on from Newman and thats going to suck.


:shock: :shock: PK finally likes Trae Waynes?!! This is a true Minneapolis miracle! :lol: Just messing man.

I’m telling you it takes times for DBs to adapt to this defense. Look at what Waynes and Sendejo did after they had some time in this defense. That’s why I’m not worried about Alexander. Alexander had a very similar 2nd year that Waynes did. Made some flashy plays but had some bad ones. I think it’s time for Newman to go anyways. He truly lost a step this year. Sure the depth and leadership hurts but he didn’t look too hot this year. We definitely need some CB depth this offseason. I looked and I don’t see any players in FA that played for Zim in the past so that sucks.

But I think Rhodes, Waynes and Alexander as a top 3 will be as good as it gets across the nfl next year

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Thu Feb 01, 2018 8:11 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
Seems like all of the other responses to the OP have covered everything I wanted to say, so I'll just pile on with a WTF!?!! Waynes is literally one of the best open field tacklers in football and his coverage this season was VASTLY improved. He RARELY got beat, and probably half of the catches he gave up were well-defended, but the receiver made remarkable plays. He's one of the best in football. Wayne seems to be a very strange target of a suggestion that we need to move on.


Thu Feb 01, 2018 3:31 pm
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
He's only 25 years old and he's actually improved over the years from being an absolute liability in coverage to being pretty solid this year. He hasn't been great and he has been beaten his fair share of times, he's not as good as Rhodes, but Rhodes wasn't as good as he is today for quite some time and he really didn't become the force that it he now until last year when he was 26. I think we have to give him at least another year because of how high his ceiling is and make a decision then. CB is a tough position to play, and probably explains why the Vikings have for the longest time until the Zimmer era struggled with having good CBs.


Thu Feb 01, 2018 3:49 pm
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
Wow I take that back Newman just came out and said he DOES plan on coming back for his 16th season. Just crazy that a guy can still play CB somewhat effectively at age 40

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Thu Feb 01, 2018 3:57 pm
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Wow I take that back Newman just came out and said he DOES plan on coming back for his 16th season. Just crazy that a guy can still play CB somewhat effectively at age 40

I love Terence Newman. But there were times this year that he looked his age. I hope he can still be effective. Mack Alexander needs to take the next step in his development, much like Waynes did this year.

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Fri Feb 02, 2018 11:47 pm
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Wow I take that back Newman just came out and said he DOES plan on coming back for his 16th season. Just crazy that a guy can still play CB somewhat effectively at age 40

I love Terence Newman. But there were times this year that he looked his age. I hope he can still be effective. Mack Alexander needs to take the next step in his development, much like Waynes did this year.


I agree. Hopefully Newman and Mack can split the snaps. Newman wants a ring, and would probably play better then last year. And every sign points to Mack getting better. We still are going to have to draft a fairly decent CB though this year. We need that and a NT in this coming draft.


Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:38 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
I think Waynes had a solid year--it can't be easy playing opposite of Xavier, and he held his own. Mac is the one that needs to improve next season.


Sat Feb 03, 2018 9:53 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
PurpleKoolaid wrote:
J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Wow I take that back Newman just came out and said he DOES plan on coming back for his 16th season. Just crazy that a guy can still play CB somewhat effectively at age 40

I love Terence Newman. But there were times this year that he looked his age. I hope he can still be effective. Mack Alexander needs to take the next step in his development, much like Waynes did this year.


I agree. Hopefully Newman and Mack can split the snaps. Newman wants a ring, and would probably play better then last year. And every sign points to Mack getting better. We still are going to have to draft a fairly decent CB though this year. We need that and a NT in this coming draft.


Linval is a NT. We need a 3 tech DT. This draft has 3 very good ones too

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Sat Feb 03, 2018 10:13 am
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
If we could somehow get another lock down corner across from Rhodes that would be amazing. Not sure I believe in Trae Waynes as long-term starter, but there is zero reason to move on from him at this point in time.

I don't buy PFF's rating on Mackensie Alexander's coverage this season. He didn't sure look like the number two corner covering the slot. He needs to improve. Newman is losing steps, I'd love him back but he shouldn't be playing more than 30% of the snaps at this point in his career.

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Sun Feb 04, 2018 5:17 pm
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
HardcoreVikesFan wrote:
If we could somehow get another lock down corner across from Rhodes that would be amazing. Not sure I believe in Trae Waynes as long-term starter, but there is zero reason to move on from him at this point in time.

I don't buy PFF's rating on Mackensie Alexander's coverage this season. He didn't sure look like the number two corner covering the slot. He needs to improve. Newman is losing steps, I'd love him back but he shouldn't be playing more than 30% of the snaps at this point in his career.


Towards the end of the year, Waynes was a lock down. More of a lock down than Rhodes was

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Sun Feb 04, 2018 7:03 pm
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Post Re: Time to move on from Waynes
The fact that he improved and played great all season is meaningless to you?


Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:20 pm
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