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 Next years QB 
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Post Re: Next years QB
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“Is money a part of it? Sure. Is it the only thing? No,” Cousins said on PFT Live. “It is about winning, and that’s what I want more than anything, so I’m going to be willing to make sacrifices or do what has to be done to make sure I’m in the best possible position to win, and that’s what the focus is going to be.”


We should offer him $100M over 4 years and see if he takes it.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... -help-win/


Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:55 pm
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Post Re: Next years QB
TSonn wrote:
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“Is money a part of it? Sure. Is it the only thing? No,” Cousins said on PFT Live. “It is about winning, and that’s what I want more than anything, so I’m going to be willing to make sacrifices or do what has to be done to make sure I’m in the best possible position to win, and that’s what the focus is going to be.”


We should offer him $100M over 4 years and see if he takes it.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... -help-win/


I think we should let the Jets pay him $25M for 5 years and bring back one of our guys who's already in touch with our current offense, like Case Keenum. Even if it costs us $20M for a year of his service, if he kills it again then you can probably get him for a longer term deal and you can be more confident that he's going to come back and produce rather than just signing a long term deal with someone like Cousins. It's not much different from bringing someone in from the draft other than that Cousins has proven himself at the NFL level, but he hasn't proven that he can work with our players, our coaches and be what the Vikings want and need him to be. Case Keenum and Teddy Bridgewater have, but there are definitely risks with them too.


Tue Jan 30, 2018 5:19 pm
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Post Re: Next years QB
Texas Vike wrote:
Consider me convinced, Kapp. You present a solid argument in favor of Cousins.

How likely do you think it is that the Ricker pulls the trigger on Cousins? He is a gambling man by nature, but even so... I'd say it's unlikely.

Great question. I have no idea. My hope is that with $60 million in cap space, Spielman would at least consider a run at Cousins. It still leaves plenty to sign guys like Hunter, Barr and others down the road.

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
If you’re cousins and you get a $28 million offer from the Vikings but a $32 million offer from the Jets, what do you take?

Cousins has said that winning is a pretty big component of it, as well as the money. And it's not like he's short on cash. Look at his life right now. We're talking about a 4th-round draft choice who just played the past two seasons for a tick south of $44 million. Think about that for a moment. Kirk Cousins was the fifth-highest paid QB in the entire NFL in 2017. He made more than Rodgers, more than Brady, and more than Roethlisberger. How many contracts in the NFL are ever guaranteed for $44 million? Very few. This man has earned a lot of money already. He's set for life by almost any measure.

Also, knowing what I know about his upbringing, family, etc., I would say there are things more important to him in life than money. Don't get me wrong. He's going to get the best deal he can. But if given a choice between $32 million with the Jets and $28 million with the Vikings, it wouldn't surprise me to see him take the lower number in order to play for a winner.

I'll say it again. If you're a free agent, and the Vikings come calling ... with their incredible stadium, their state-of-the-art training facility about to open, their $60 million in cap space, the opportunity to play for a coach in Mike Zimmer who is universally respected around the league, and the chance to play for a team that just finished one game from the Super Bowl ... you're going to be very, very interested. Minnesota is arguably the most attractive place in the NFL for a free agent to sign. Rick Spielman should be in the running for just about anybody he wants.

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Tue Jan 30, 2018 5:29 pm
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Post Re: Next years QB
Slick Rick wrote:
TSonn wrote:
Quote:
“Is money a part of it? Sure. Is it the only thing? No,” Cousins said on PFT Live. “It is about winning, and that’s what I want more than anything, so I’m going to be willing to make sacrifices or do what has to be done to make sure I’m in the best possible position to win, and that’s what the focus is going to be.”


We should offer him $100M over 4 years and see if he takes it.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... -help-win/


I think we should let the Jets pay him $25M for 5 years and bring back one of our guys who's already in touch with our current offense, like Case Keenum. Even if it costs us $20M for a year of his service, if he kills it again then you can probably get him for a longer term deal and you can be more confident that he's going to come back and produce rather than just signing a long term deal with someone like Cousins. It's not much different from bringing someone in from the draft other than that Cousins has proven himself at the NFL level, but he hasn't proven that he can work with our players, our coaches and be what the Vikings want and need him to be. Case Keenum and Teddy Bridgewater have, but there are definitely risks with them too.


I'll go out on a limb here and say the only way the Vikes keep Keenum this year is if they franchise him. He had a great season and it's a QB-starved league. Someone will be willing to offer him a multi-year deal with enough up front to ensure he'll take the offer. So for the Vikings to keep him, they'd either have to match that up front or, if they're still not convinced he warrants a multi-year commitment, they're going to have to use the franchise tag on him. And if they did that, and I were his agent, I'd insist that one-year deal include a clause that prevents the Vikings from using the franchise tag on him the following year.

But here's my main problem with that - Keenum wasn't consistent enough to warrant either a long-term deal or the franchise tag. He had issues seeing and hitting open deep receivers, which cost the Vikings scoring opportunities, especially as the season went on. His accuracy was off at times. Some simple throws against Philly were horribly botched at a time when every easy throw had to be made. He had ball security issues that resulted in costly fumbles and interceptions, with the highlight being the duck he lobbed against Philly that resulted in a defensive score for the Eagles.

I'm not saying this was endemic or typified his season. He performed very well at times, but I keep wondering if people aren't looking at Keenum and his performance in relative terms (i.e. this guy was a 3rd-stringer playing under a minimum deal and look what he did!). If you look at him as simple starting QB, he looks less impressive, especially in the playoffs. If you look at him compared to other FA QBs who are looking for longer-term, larger deals and starting gigs, Keenum starts to look much less attractive, at least to me. He just hasn't done it at a high enough level long enough and for enough time for me to be sold that he belongs in the long-term commitment, NFL starting QB conversation.

I feel the same way about Bridgewater, albeit far less certain about his longer term viability as a starting QB (or even a backup, for that matter).

That really leaves the Vikings with a single on-roster option in Bradford, and while I understand the concerns about his knee holding up, he's also the only guy on the roster that is a guy defenses might be actually afraid of given his ability to sling the ball and his consistent mid and deep range accuracy. If Bradford is healthy and has time, he'll do to almost every defense what he did against the Saints to start the season, especially if he has a run/pass option with a healthy Dalvin Cook and he has TE's he trusts can get open and catch the ball.

Cousins would do well with the Vikings too for much the same reason.

Brees would probably make the Vikings Superbowl favorites heading into next season. I just don't see him leaving New Orleans.


Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:27 pm
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Post Re: Next years QB
J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Texas Vike wrote:
Consider me convinced, Kapp. You present a solid argument in favor of Cousins.

How likely do you think it is that the Ricker pulls the trigger on Cousins? He is a gambling man by nature, but even so... I'd say it's unlikely.

Great question. I have no idea. My hope is that with $60 million in cap space, Spielman would at least consider a run at Cousins. It still leaves plenty to sign guys like Hunter, Barr and others down the road.

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
If you’re cousins and you get a $28 million offer from the Vikings but a $32 million offer from the Jets, what do you take?

Cousins has said that winning is a pretty big component of it, as well as the money. And it's not like he's short on cash. Look at his life right now. We're talking about a 4th-round draft choice who just played the past two seasons for a tick south of $44 million. Think about that for a moment. Kirk Cousins was the fifth-highest paid QB in the entire NFL in 2017. He made more than Rodgers, more than Brady, and more than Roethlisberger. How many contracts in the NFL are ever guaranteed for $44 million? Very few. This man has earned a lot of money already. He's set for life by almost any measure.

Also, knowing what I know about his upbringing, family, etc., I would say there are things more important to him in life than money. Don't get me wrong. He's going to get the best deal he can. But if given a choice between $32 million with the Jets and $28 million with the Vikings, it wouldn't surprise me to see him take the lower number in order to play for a winner.

I'll say it again. If you're a free agent, and the Vikings come calling ... with their incredible stadium, their state-of-the-art training facility about to open, their $60 million in cap space, the opportunity to play for a coach in Mike Zimmer who is universally respected around the league, and the chance to play for a team that just finished one game from the Super Bowl ... you're going to be very, very interested. Minnesota is arguably the most attractive place in the NFL for a free agent to sign. Rick Spielman should be in the running for just about anybody he wants.


It always surprises me that more guys don't do what Brady did where he takes a pay cut so he can be surrounded by better supporting cast. Granted, football contracts aren't fully guaranteed but at some point you've made enough money and it probably makes sense to take less and funnel more into an O-line that will keep you upright.

Maybe Cousins will think along these lines but it seems like a lot of QB's are greedy to the detriment of their team. Stafford is a good example.


Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:04 pm
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Post Re: Next years QB
Holy sh** Alex Smith just got traded to Washington!!

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Tue Jan 30, 2018 10:00 pm
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Post Re: Next years QB
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Holy sh** Alex Smith just got traded to Washington!!
Well Cousins is done there for sure. I still would rather have Keenum. He did so much for the team and the fans love him.

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Tue Jan 30, 2018 10:10 pm
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Post Re: Next years QB
PurpleMustReign wrote:
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Holy sh** Alex Smith just got traded to Washington!!
Well Cousins is done there for sure. I still would rather have Keenum. He did so much for the team and the fans love him.

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I still take Cousins over Keenum though. Depending on what they command I’d pay 5 mill more to have cousins than Keenum. And again Keenum could easily be a product of shurmurs system. I love Case and Hes my 2nd option but cousins trumps him any day

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Tue Jan 30, 2018 10:39 pm
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Post Re: Next years QB
Lots of teams in market for a QB, Buffalo and Cleveland,Jets, Cardinals some others also,Do you think Cousins will command 25-30 mil?


Tue Jan 30, 2018 10:53 pm
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Post Re: Next years QB
Husker Vike wrote:
Lots of teams in market for a QB, Buffalo and Cleveland,Jets, Cardinals some others also,Do you think Cousins will command 25-30 mil?

There had been talk that Washington might put the transition tag on Cousins, setting his salary at $28 million and forcing other teams to offer more. But with Smith coming on board, it seems highly unlikely to me (even borderline stupid) that they would use the transition tag. Another team with a lot of cap space, like Jacksonville or the Jets, could blow the $28 million out of the water by offering Cousins a hugely front-loaded deal. Washington wouldn't have the cap space to match. If nobody matches, the Skins are stuck with his contract.

With Smith reportedly being offered an extension by the Redskins for $23.5 million per year, tagging Cousins could end up being a disaster. It could force the 'Skins to tie up more than $50 million for two guys who play the same position. I just can't see them risking it. But what do I know?

With this trade for Smith, it sure seems like the Redskins are going to let Cousins walk. If that's the case, this is about to get really interesting.

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Tue Jan 30, 2018 11:31 pm
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Post Re: Next years QB
For what they gave up for smith in my opinion they could just have well signed cousins at least he knows their system.
It will make things interesting for sure.


Tue Jan 30, 2018 11:38 pm
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Post Re: Next years QB
Cousins is the answer. This team in its current form has reached it's limit. Kirk is the only answer out there that can get us to the next level, unless Bridge grows quickly. Case isn't the answer. He will win us some games. He's good enough to win 11 games a season but we will be stuck at one and done or going home soon after.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 12:05 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
Last time a QB getting paid over $20 million-a-year led a team to the Super Bowl?

Zero.

Focus that money on resigning our defensive players. Cousins will command top dollar.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 1:17 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
Wow Smith got PAID. The only prayer the Vikings have is if Cousins really puts playing for a good team over money. And even then, no OC hurts those odds even more. It is interesting Smith more or less got the long term deal they wouldn't give Cousins.

Looks like the Vikings will be overpaying no matter who they grab.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 3:50 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
S197 wrote:
Wow Smith got PAID. The only prayer the Vikings have is if Cousins really puts playing for a good team over money. And even then, no OC hurts those odds even more. It is interesting Smith more or less got the long term deal they wouldn't give Cousins.

Looks like the Vikings will be overpaying no matter who they grab.


If the rumors about Stefanski are true, I'd have to think that it makes it more likely that we work something out with Case. I'm intrigued by the possibility of landing Cousins, though. I think he is worth the extra money and has a much higher ceiling than Case. The one thing I do really like about Case is his leadership qualities, his character, and his connection to this team's players. I don't know what to think about Cousins regarding those intangibles. It seems that some Skins fans think he is a delicate one. Whenever I have watched him, I see a dude with major talent and lots of grit.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:34 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
kidfozzy. wrote:
Last time a QB getting paid over $20 million-a-year led a team to the Super Bowl?

Zero.

Focus that money on resigning our defensive players. Cousins will command top dollar.

That's misleading. The era of $20 million quarterbacks hasn't been around that long.

It's also untrue. Matt Ryan made $23.75 million in 2016 ($15.75 million in salary, $8 million in bonus). Tom Brady's average compensation for his current contract is over $20 million, even though his "salary" is technically $1 million.

As for focusing money on the defense -- no team that spent more money on defense than offense has won the Super Bowl in the past five years (which is the farthest Over The Cap goes back), and only one team has even made it. Take a guess which unit the Vikings spent the most on last year.

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:35 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
Texas Vike wrote:
S197 wrote:
Wow Smith got PAID. The only prayer the Vikings have is if Cousins really puts playing for a good team over money. And even then, no OC hurts those odds even more. It is interesting Smith more or less got the long term deal they wouldn't give Cousins.

Looks like the Vikings will be overpaying no matter who they grab.


If the rumors about Stefanski are true, I'd have to think that it makes it more likely that we work something out with Case. I'm intrigued by the possibility of landing Cousins, though. I think he is worth the extra money and has a much higher ceiling than Case. The one thing I do really like about Case is his leadership qualities, his character, and his connection to this team's players. I don't know what to think about Cousins regarding those intangibles. It seems that some Skins fans think he is a delicate one. Whenever I have watched him, I see a dude with major talent and lots of grit.

This is a great question. The answer depends on whom you ask.

Scot McCloughan, the Redskins' former GM, has one take.

Scot McCloughan wrote:
“He’s a good player. Is he special? I don’t see special. But also, we were still building a roster around him to make him special.”

Mike Shanahan, on the other hand, has a different take. He has said the sky is the limit for Cousins.

Mike Shanahan wrote:
“There’s no question in my mind that he’s a special player,” Shanahan said of Cousins. “If you don’t think he’s a special player, that means you don’t watch him practice very often. You take a look at some of the games he’s played in. He hasn’t played with a good defense that’s been in the upper half of the league, I don’t think, since he’s been there. You can’t always do it by yourself. You got to have an offense and a defense for a quarterback to be really successful … especially when you get in the playoffs. But I guarantee you he’s a special guy.”


Let's see. Failed GM or two-time Super Bowl winning coach? Hmmmm. Tough call.

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 7:43 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
Idk, I've just never been too impressed with Cousins. He has taken some mediocre Washington WR corps and made them look pretty solid, but all I can think of is how Case took the team by the horns and had an awesome season. The look on his face when he led the SKOL chant after the TD against the Saints convinced me that he deserves a chance to get the job done here. Whether system or talent, Case had an extraordinary year and I want him to have another chance here.

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 8:12 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
I mean Case is no doubt my second option behind Cousins. Mainly because yes, Cousins has a higher ceiling. ALSO, this has been Case's only good year in the league. So with Shurmur gone, it does make me nervous. Because Case very well could have been a product of that system. Maybe not though? Who knows. But if we are considering tagging Case or only throwing him $5 mill less than Cousins, just go after Cousins

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Post Re: Next years QB
J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Husker Vike wrote:
Lots of teams in market for a QB, Buffalo and Cleveland,Jets, Cardinals some others also,Do you think Cousins will command 25-30 mil?

There had been talk that Washington might put the transition tag on Cousins, setting his salary at $28 million and forcing other teams to offer more. But with Smith coming on board, it seems highly unlikely to me (even borderline stupid) that they would use the transition tag. Another team with a lot of cap space, like Jacksonville or the Jets, could blow the $28 million out of the water by offering Cousins a hugely front-loaded deal. Washington wouldn't have the cap space to match. If nobody matches, the Skins are stuck with his contract.

With Smith reportedly being offered an extension by the Redskins for $23.5 million per year, tagging Cousins could end up being a disaster. It could force the 'Skins to tie up more than $50 million for two guys who play the same position. I just can't see them risking it. But what do I know?

With this trade for Smith, it sure seems like the Redskins are going to let Cousins walk. If that's the case, this is about to get really interesting.


It was reported that Jacksonville is going to keep Bortles according to Rapapport. The only two teams above us with more cap space that need a QB are the Browns and Jets. Neither are very appealing for Cousins if you ask me

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Post Re: Next years QB
Teams cap space that need a QB currently:

Browns~ $109 million

Jets~ $72 million

Vikings~ $52 million (Spotrac is saying $56)

Bills~ $29 million

Broncos~ $26 million

Cardinals~ $8 million


As you can see, after us, there is a drastic drop off. This also goes to show just how good of a job Spielman and Zim have done to have such a good roster and still have a top of cap space. All of those teams listed are mostly weaker, bottom of the barrel teams. There isnt a team up there more appealing than us. I dont see how Buffalo, Denver or Arizona can even swing it. Unless they make some drastic cuts. Which I'm sure some will do but as of right now, it looks like us, NY and Cleveland. One thing that I will say is we have never been a team thats been in cap hell.

Also, is Shariff Floyds contract included in that? It looks like on spotrac it is. Thats another $6 million. We can release Floyd post 6/1/18 and save all of that by the looks of it.

Also guys like B-Rob and Wright are taking up $8-9 million. We can save $3 million if we cut Wright post 6/1 but have around $1.5 in dead money. We can clear $2.2 mill if we cut B-Rob post 6/1 but have over $1 mill in dead money or save all of it if we trade him for peanuts post 6/1

The more I look at this whole thing with Cousins the more I think its doable. This is going to get interesting

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 8:55 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
Can someone please fill me in on why we’re so fascinated by Cousins? He had an outstanding year in 2016 (almost 5,000 yards) and two other 4,000 yard seasons. But he doesn’t win. In those three seasons the Skins were 9-7, 8-7-1, and 7-9. I don’t think he’s worth the kind of money people are talking about and I believe his stats have been inflated from putting up yards late in games when the Skins were losing (I don’t know this for a fact, it’s an assumption I’m making), similar to Stafford. Now, I don’t follow the Skins and haven’t watched many of their games, so if there’s something I’m missing please let me know, but I just don’t see why we want to spend $20mil/year on him.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:11 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Teams cap space that need a QB currently:

Browns~ $109 million

Jets~ $72 million

Vikings~ $52 million (Spotrac is saying $56)

Bills~ $29 million

Broncos~ $26 million

Cardinals~ $8 million


As you can see, after us, there is a drastic drop off. This also goes to show just how good of a job Spielman and Zim have done to have such a good roster and still have a top of cap space. All of those teams listed are mostly weaker, bottom of the barrel teams. There isnt a team up there more appealing than us. I dont see how Buffalo, Denver or Arizona can even swing it. Unless they make some drastic cuts. Which I'm sure some will do but as of right now, it looks like us, NY and Cleveland. One thing that I will say is we have never been a team thats been in cap hell.

Also, is Shariff Floyds contract included in that? It looks like on spotrac it is. Thats another $6 million. We can release Floyd post 6/1/18 and save all of that by the looks of it.

Also guys like B-Rob and Wright are taking up $8-9 million. We can save $3 million if we cut Wright post 6/1 but have around $1.5 in dead money. We can clear $2.2 mill if we cut B-Rob post 6/1 but have over $1 mill in dead money or save all of it if we trade him for peanuts post 6/1

The more I look at this whole thing with Cousins the more I think its doable. This is going to get interesting


Don't forget Latavius Murray. They might also be able to get Rudolph to restructure.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:27 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
PurpleMustReign wrote:
The look on his face when he led the SKOL chant after the TD against the Saints convinced me that he deserves a chance to get the job done here.

Really? The look on his face when he led the Skol chant? That's the bar for whether Keenum deserves a chance to get the job done here?


Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:28 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
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he doesn’t win.In those three seasons the Skins were 9-7, 8-7-1, and 7-9.


Well the yardage is so high because the defence ship so many points...which is also why his wins aren't that great. Look at last season, 7 of those 9 loses involved conceding 30+ points. There isn't a lot a QB can do against that (the other two were 29 points and 18 points last game of the season with nothing to play for)


Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:30 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
S197 wrote:
Wow Smith got PAID. The only prayer the Vikings have is if Cousins really puts playing for a good team over money. And even then, no OC hurts those odds even more. It is interesting Smith more or less got the long term deal they wouldn't give Cousins.

Looks like the Vikings will be overpaying no matter who they grab.


It is NFL QBs, no matter who they get they are going to have to PAY. Might as well pay for the guy with the best track record/injury history.

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:39 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
akvikingsfan wrote:
Can someone please fill me in on why we’re so fascinated by Cousins? He had an outstanding year in 2016 (almost 5,000 yards) and two other 4,000 yard seasons. But he doesn’t win. In those three seasons the Skins were 9-7, 8-7-1, and 7-9. I don’t think he’s worth the kind of money people are talking about and I believe his stats have been inflated from putting up yards late in games when the Skins were losing (I don’t know this for a fact, it’s an assumption I’m making), similar to Stafford. Now, I don’t follow the Skins and haven’t watched many of their games, so if there’s something I’m missing please let me know, but I just don’t see why we want to spend $20mil/year on him.


Looking at those years, here's what we can glean from those seasons, defensively for the Redskins:

2015: 24 Points Against (17th)
2016: 24 Points Against (19th)
2017: 24 Points Against (27th)

On average, the defense gave up 24 points a game for three years in a row, which is not stellar defense. Comparatively, the Vikings in the same three seasons:

2015: 19 Points Against (5th)
2016: 19 Points Against (6th)
2017: 16 Points Against (1st)

The key difference is not that Cousins couldn't win, it's that the Redskins defenses always ranked amongst the lower half in the league, the most egregious of those years being this year, when they were downright awful. With our defense, Kirk Cousins would likely have been leading the Redskins to the playoffs every single one of those years. (I'm not even getting into our offenses, because the Redskins offenses were much better than ours bar 2017).


Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:42 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
I don't see Cousins as a big improvement over Keenum. I think the total yards numbers are very misleading when comparing the two players. Case had 59 fewer attempts and a *lot* fewer "garbage time" yards as the Vikings were running at the end of games mostly not passing against weaker prevent situations. Case had the higher rating last year, completion percentage.

When comparing Cousins and Keenum it seems like you might as well go with the guy who already has a relationship with the team and receivers. Of course if you believe Keenum's performance was a fluke rather than an elongated progression to become a better player - five years to 'blossom' instead of the normal three that people tend to look for - then Cousins makes sense. Otherwise I just don't see it.

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Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:51 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
I'm not so sure Rick would get in a bidding war for Cousins. With smith gone the demand for Cousins will go up.
Myself I would sooner save the money and build our team.
If our offensive Line would have been better at the end of the season I think Case could have got us to the SB.
We were soooo close this year.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:51 am
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Post Re: Next years QB
ChicagoViking wrote:
PurpleMustReign wrote:
The look on his face when he led the SKOL chant after the TD against the Saints convinced me that he deserves a chance to get the job done here.

Really? The look on his face when he led the Skol chant? That's the bar for whether Keenum deserves a chance to get the job done here?


:lol:

Took the words out of my mouth.


Wed Jan 31, 2018 10:19 am
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