PFF: Do the Minnesota Vikings have the NFL's best WR duo?

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Re: PFF: Do the Minnesota Vikings have the NFL's best WR duo

Post by 808vikingsfan » Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:06 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: Yes agreed 100%. Big Ben is wearing down. He looked good last night but at the same time, Tennessee is the most pathetic 6-4 team I think I've ever seen. But they are in the worst division in football so thats part of it too. Their defense is terrible and their offense is underperforming and somehow does not have a running game with two studs back their and a good OL.

Pitts defense has been lights out. They are what scares me. Not their offense. We handled them just fine this year.

Love the Madden view last night. As much as I hate Roethlisburger, he was on point last night. Some of those passes he threw were indefensible.

AB is good.
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Re: PFF: Do the Minnesota Vikings have the NFL's best WR duo

Post by mansquatch » Fri Nov 17, 2017 3:19 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: Yes agreed 100%. Big Ben is wearing down. He looked good last night but at the same time, Tennessee is the most pathetic 6-4 team I think I've ever seen. But they are in the worst division in football so thats part of it too. Their defense is terrible and their offense is underperforming and somehow does not have a running game with two studs back their and a good OL.

Pitts defense has been lights out. They are what scares me. Not their offense. We handled them just fine this year.
TEN seems to have built a stout Run D, but for some reason they haven't yet figured out that if you can't defend the pass you will lose against an great QB. You'd think a guy like Dick Labeau would know better.
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Re: PFF: Do the Minnesota Vikings have the NFL's best WR duo

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:03 pm

PurpleKoolaid wrote:I dont like Waynes, Keenum that much (although he is one of the better backups we have had, and has been both luck and good enough to win games) Treadwell, or Murray. I think they all under perform and Treadwell and Waynes we drafted too high. Until they play better you aernt going to change my mind. Just like I didnt listen to you when I liked Theilen and wanted to see more of him, and you kept asking why. Now you know why. Treadwell has had enough time to impress the coaches before this year. He just hasnt.
Here are some facts to counter your opinion of Trae Waynes:
Vikings.com wrote:Trae Waynes was stride-for-stride with Maurice Harris in the first quarter, but the receiver made a one-handed catch for a 36-yard touchdown on Washington’s opening drive. Waynes, however, bounced back nicely. PFF counted three other times that Washington threw into Waynes’ coverage, and the 2015 first-round pick allowed just one reception for 7 yards. PFF calculated the passer rating allowed by Waynes since Week 5 at 77.9, “despite being thrown at 36 times over that span.” That number of targets since Week 5 is tied for fourth-most among cornerbacks.
I'd say a 77.9 QBR allowed is pretty solid, especially when you're playing across from the best cover corner in the NFL.

I think Trae Waynes was drafted right about where he should have been.
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Re: PFF: Do the Minnesota Vikings have the NFL's best WR duo

Post by dead_poet » Sat Nov 18, 2017 9:07 pm

J. Kapp 11 wrote:I'd say a 77.9 QBR allowed is pretty solid, especially when you're playing across from the best cover corner in the NFL.

I think Trae Waynes was drafted right about where he should have been.
Numbers are nice, but I think we also need some context here over the last four games; specifically who has he been going up against?

To set the stage, prior to week 6 Waynes allowed the fifth-most receptions and the seventh-most receiving yards to opposing receivers, per PFF. What caused this turnaround? Let's dive in a little bit.

Week 6 vs. GB:

Quarterback Aaron Rodgers (1 drive) Brett Hundley thereafter.

Perimeter WRs: Jordy Nelson, DeVante Adams

Analysis: Brett Hundley was/is abysmal, in no way ready to play in that game and is not a good quarterback (yet). GB has a couple of solid starters (Nelson/Adams) but Hundley was/is so terrible it didn't matter. He wasn't really a threat.

---

Week 7 vs Baltimore:

Quaterback Joe Flacco

Perimeter WRs: Mike Wallace (Rhodes) and Michael Campanaro. Maclin was out this game.

Analysis: Joe Flacco is terrible and the entire Baltimore offense is inept (30th in total offense). Flacco currently rates #27 in the NFL in passing yards; 8-10 TD/INT ratio and is averaging a terrible 5.3 YPA. Micael Campanaro has 27 career receptions. In essence Waynes was going up against one of the worst QBs in the league and was covering essentially a 3rd or fourth-string wide receiver.

---

Week 8 vs. Cleveland

Quarterback: DeShone Kizer

Perimeter WRs: Ricado Lewis, Bryce Treggs

Analysis: See above (Flacco summary) but these guys are even worse.

---

Week 9 vs. Washington

Quarterback: Kirk Cousins

Perimeter WRs: Josh Doctson, Maurice Harris

Analysis: This was Waynes' best game out of this stretch given the level of quarterback play. He allowed that one long TD but I'm not going to hold that against him too much. It was a good play by Cousins and Harris. That said, the level of WRs he was going up against weren't anything to write home about, especially with Pryor an afterthought and Doctson not yet establishing he's anything special. Harris had just been called up from the practice squad.

Final thoughts:

So yes, Kapp, he has performed well during this stretch but he was going up against some of the worst QB/WR combos in the league, many of them backups to third/fourth stringers. That's why I'm skeptical he's improved as much as people say. That said, Woods and Watkins will represent his biggest challenge with a red-hot QB in Goff. I don't expect Waynes to hold up nearly as well as in this stretch. Of course, I hope I'm mistaken. I fully expect Waynes to allow at least one touchdown pass and will probably have great position on a number of other receivers only to fail to get his head around and make a play. He'll probably also have one PI/holding but make a couple of nice tackles.

I really want to be wrong tomorrow.
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Re: PFF: Do the Minnesota Vikings have the NFL's best WR duo

Post by autobon7 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 10:42 pm

Laserman wrote:No, I don't. Just off the top of my head the steelers recievers are better, Oakland's Wrs are better too. Dallas WRS are just as good if not better. Our QRs are Pretty freaking good IF DIGGS can STAY HEALTHY. Anthony Carter was smaller than Diggs but he could stay on the Field. What an awesome WR A.C. was
The ONLY thing I agree with here is the fact that AC was an incredible WR.
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Re: PFF: Do the Minnesota Vikings have the NFL's best WR duo

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 10:44 pm

dead_poet wrote: So yes, Kapp, he has performed well during this stretch but he was going up against some of the worst QB/WR combos in the league, many of them backups to third/fourth stringers. That's why I'm skeptical he's improved as much as people say. That said, Woods and Watkins will represent his biggest challenge with a red-hot QB in Goff. I don't expect Waynes to hold up nearly as well as in this stretch. Of course, I hope I'm mistaken. I fully expect Waynes to allow at least one touchdown pass and will probably have great position on a number of other receivers only to fail to get his head around and make a play. He'll probably also have one PI/holding but make a couple of nice tackles.

I really want to be wrong tomorrow.
You got your wish.
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Re: PFF: Do the Minnesota Vikings have the NFL's best WR duo

Post by dead_poet » Sun Nov 19, 2017 10:45 pm

J. Kapp 11 wrote: You got your wish.
So happy.
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Re: PFF: Do the Minnesota Vikings have the NFL's best WR duo

Post by 808vikingsfan » Sun Nov 19, 2017 10:59 pm

Through week 11, Adam Thielen #2 in receiving yds
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Re: PFF: Do the Minnesota Vikings have the NFL's best WR duo

Post by mansquatch » Mon Nov 20, 2017 12:17 pm

Remember the old cliche' of the "No Name Defense"?

I think the Vikings have turned it on it's head. We now have a No-Name Offense. One that has allowed one sack in 5 weeks, has a guy who is probably a top 5 WR, at least this season, and just keeps on making plays when it counts.

SKOL BABY!
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