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Headed toward disaster?
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Author:  J. Kapp 11 [ Fri Mar 31, 2017 11:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Mothman wrote:
S197 wrote:
Ah sorry I missed that. It will be interesting how they play this one, you could go with an older "safer" vet like a Fitzpatrick or maybe take a flier on a Kaepernick or RG3. There's also a few guys who have shown some promise but very inconsistently, guys like Keenum or Yates maybe who I assume would be cheaper options.


It will definitely be interesting to see how they handle it and if they try to go with a one year contract or something longer.

I'd actually love Ryan Fitzpatrick as a backup.

He's one of those tweener guys. Not quite good enough to be a franchise guy, but definitely capable of keeping your team above water for a few weeks while your starter heals.

Last year, I always felt like the season was over if Bradford got hurt. Shaun Hill looked like he was throwing a medicine ball.

Of course, Fitzpatrick is likely going to cost nearly starter's money.

Author:  Texas Vike [ Fri Mar 31, 2017 12:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

J. Kapp 11 wrote:
Shaun Hill looked like he was throwing a medicine ball.


:rofl:

Author:  mansquatch [ Fri Mar 31, 2017 1:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

I think your assessment of Fitzpatrick is fair. However, I think his well documented carelessness with the football would likely be a major hurdle for the current Vikings coaching staff. My sense is they'd prefer a guy who doesn't give it up, even if that means he throws for 150.

This might change under Schurmer, but count me in that camp that thinks such a deviation would be a surprise.

Author:  RFIP [ Fri Mar 31, 2017 9:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Keenum is a good pick up. The guy is tough and is a great team guy. He'll work well with Sam. What he lacks in talent he makes up for in heart. Fans will love the guy.

Author:  PurpleMustReign [ Sat Apr 01, 2017 10:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

RFIP wrote:
Keenum is a good pick up. The guy is tough and is a great team guy. He'll work well with Sam. What he lacks in talent he makes up for in heart. Fans will love the guy.


I like him better thabn most of the backups we've had in the last 10+ years.

Author:  720pete [ Sun Apr 02, 2017 8:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Healthy Bradford > healthy Bridgewater

Author:  PurpleMustReign [ Sun Apr 02, 2017 10:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

720pete wrote:
Healthy Bradford > healthy Bridgewater

And it's not even close. I really wish they'd extend Bradford.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

Author:  Laserman [ Mon Apr 03, 2017 11:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Demarates wrote:
PurpleMustReign wrote:
Jesus Christ. Is it really that hard for Zimmer to see that Bradford is way better than Teddy probably ever will be?


Yeah, I don't see TB getting truly healthy again. And I wasn't 100% happy with him to begin with.


Exactly !!! OF TB comes back what do you have really? A inexperienced injured QB who still reads Defenses slow, has no accurate Mid or Deep passing ability who is two years behind in his development. If he Can't return to playing status this season it's over for him.

Author:  fiestavike [ Tue Apr 04, 2017 2:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Laserman wrote:
Demarates wrote:
PurpleMustReign wrote:
Jesus Christ. Is it really that hard for Zimmer to see that Bradford is way better than Teddy probably ever will be?


Yeah, I don't see TB getting truly healthy again. And I wasn't 100% happy with him to begin with.


Exactly !!! OF TB comes back what do you have really? A inexperienced injured QB who still reads Defenses slow, has no accurate Mid or Deep passing ability who is two years behind in his development. If he Can't return to playing status this season it's over for him.


It would be incredibly exciting to see him return to playing status this year!

Author:  Laserman [ Mon Apr 24, 2017 9:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

PurpleMustReign wrote:
Jesus Christ. Is it really that hard for Zimmer to see that Bradford is way better than Teddy probably ever will be?


That's What I was thinking when I read Zimmer's comments. I thought to myself that TB will be lucky if he can get as good as Bradford is now. I myself don't believe that's even possible. Either you are accurate at throwing the Long Ball or you are not. Teddy is not. If you can't stretch the field via fear of the long pass you ain't going anywhere in todays NFL. The 49ers Dink and Dunk days are long gone.

Author:  808vikingsfan [ Mon Apr 24, 2017 10:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

PurpleMustReign wrote:
720pete wrote:
Healthy Bradford > healthy Bridgewater

And it's not even close. I really wish they'd extend Bradford.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


Maybe as far as passing goes, but I think BW is/was a better overall package (passing, scrambling, extending plays, playmaker, leadership). Remember, he bulked up last year, improved his velocity, and from what I remember, improved his deep ball.

Author:  Mothman [ Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

808vikingsfan wrote:
PurpleMustReign wrote:
720pete wrote:
Healthy Bradford > healthy Bridgewater

And it's not even close. I really wish they'd extend Bradford.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


Maybe as far as passing goes, but I think BW is/was a better overall package (passing, scrambling, extending plays, playmaker, leadership). Remember, he bulked up last year, improved his velocity, and from what I remember, improved his deep ball.


We never saw him beyond the preseason so none of that supposed improvement was ever evident in a meaningful game.

Author:  fiestavike [ Tue Apr 25, 2017 7:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Mothman wrote:
808vikingsfan wrote:


Maybe as far as passing goes, but I think BW is/was a better overall package (passing, scrambling, extending plays, playmaker, leadership). Remember, he bulked up last year, improved his velocity, and from what I remember, improved his deep ball.


We never saw him beyond the preseason so none of that supposed improvement was ever evident in a meaningful game.


Velocity and arm strength dont require a meaningful game to be evident. Other than that, he showed all those traits repeatedly in meaningful games. Its willfully obtuse to deny that he was throwing a better ball before his leg fell off.

Author:  Mothman [ Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

fiestavike wrote:
Mothman wrote:
808vikingsfan wrote:


Maybe as far as passing goes, but I think BW is/was a better overall package (passing, scrambling, extending plays, playmaker, leadership). Remember, he bulked up last year, improved his velocity, and from what I remember, improved his deep ball.


We never saw him beyond the preseason so none of that supposed improvement was ever evident in a meaningful game.


Velocity and arm strength dont require a meaningful game to be evident. Other than that, he showed all those traits repeatedly in meaningful games. Its willfully obtuse to deny that he was throwing a better ball before his leg fell off.


My point was about improvement last year, which we really never had a chance to see. I'm not being willfully obtuse, I just thought some fans filtered his preseason performance and the annual training camp hype about how much better everyone and everything was going to be through hopeful eyes and they saw a QB who was ready to break out. It happens with fans and players every year. I know I've done it.

I think the Vikes had a better QB the moment Bradford walked through the door.

Author:  fiestavike [ Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Mothman wrote:

I think the Vikes had a better QB the moment Bradford walked through the door.


Oh I know! :lol:

I think you thought the Vikings had a better QB the moment Bridgewater went down.

Author:  Mothman [ Tue Apr 25, 2017 9:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

fiestavike wrote:
Mothman wrote:

I think the Vikes had a better QB the moment Bradford walked through the door.


Oh I know! :lol:

I think you thought the Vikings had a better QB the moment Bridgewater went down.


:lol: No, because Shaun Hill was the QB at that point and he was definitely not a better option than Bridgewater.

Author:  chicagopurple [ Tue Apr 25, 2017 11:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Bridgewater is very likely NOT going to be as mobile anymore, IF he can even come back. Losing mobility, and being fragile, on a team with a very suspect front line is a recipe for disaster.

Author:  808vikingsfan [ Tue Apr 25, 2017 3:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Mothman wrote:
808vikingsfan wrote:
720pete wrote:
Healthy Bradford > healthy Bridgewater



Maybe as far as passing goes, but I think BW is/was a better overall package (passing, scrambling, extending plays, playmaker, leadership). Remember, he bulked up last year, improved his velocity, and from what I remember, improved his deep ball.


We never saw him beyond the preseason so none of that supposed improvement was ever evident in a meaningful game.


The thing is, BW took it upon himself to work on his weaknesses. That's the kind of qb the Vikings lost. That's why I believe Zimmer was so high on this kid.

Author:  Mothman [ Tue Apr 25, 2017 3:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

808vikingsfan wrote:
The thing is, BW took it upon himself to work on his weaknesses. That's the kind of qb the Vikings lost. That's why I believe Zimmer was so high on this kid.


He's been highly dedicated, no doubt about it.

Author:  Pepper2Moss [ Tue Apr 25, 2017 4:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

My god, the Bridgewater hate is off the charts in this thread... Can we give the coaching staff any benefit of the doubt on evaluating a healthy Bradford vs a healthy Bridgewater when/if the time comes? Teddy did have some part in them winning 11 games and the division in 2015 as a sophomore QB with an offensive line that was similarly atrocious as the one Bradford was working with last season.

Author:  Mothman [ Tue Apr 25, 2017 4:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

There's not much new here other than the sentence I highlighted.

Beyond 2017, status of Bradford and Bridgewater is up in the air

Quote:
That came out today when both Bradford and Vikings G.M. Rick Spielman talked to the local media as the team conducted offseason workouts.

Bradford said he doesn’t think his agent has had any discussions with the team about a contract.
Bradford’s current deal, the two-year, $36 million contract he signed with the Eagles last year before they traded him to Minnesota, expires after the season, so he’s set to be a free agent in 2018.

And Spielman said the team has no timeline on the return of Bridgewater from the devastating knee injury he suffered last year in training camp.


Over the next few weeks, we should at least get a slightly better idea of how the Vikes intend to approach the position in 2018. At that point, we'll know if they've drafted a QB and we'll know if they've picked up Bridgewater's option.

Author:  808vikingsfan [ Tue Apr 25, 2017 6:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Mothman wrote:
There's not much new here other than the sentence I highlighted.

Beyond 2017, status of Bradford and Bridgewater is up in the air

Quote:
That came out today when both Bradford and Vikings G.M. Rick Spielman talked to the local media as the team conducted offseason workouts.

Bradford said he doesn’t think his agent has had any discussions with the team about a contract.
Bradford’s current deal, the two-year, $36 million contract he signed with the Eagles last year before they traded him to Minnesota, expires after the season, so he’s set to be a free agent in 2018.

And Spielman said the team has no timeline on the return of Bridgewater from the devastating knee injury he suffered last year in training camp.


Over the next few weeks, we should at least get a slightly better idea of how the Vikes intend to approach the position in 2018. At that point, we'll know if they've drafted a QB and we'll know if they've picked up Bridgewater's option.



It would be nice to see the Vikings commit to Bradford sooner rather than later.

Author:  fiestavike [ Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Pepper2Moss wrote:
My god, the Bridgewater hate is off the charts in this thread... Can we give the coaching staff any benefit of the doubt on evaluating a healthy Bradford vs a healthy Bridgewater when/if the time comes? Teddy did have some part in them winning 11 games and the division in 2015 as a sophomore QB with an offensive line that was similarly atrocious as the one Bradford was working with last season.


But his stats didn't look that good, and the teams offensive ranking was low.

Author:  Mothman [ Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

fiestavike wrote:
Pepper2Moss wrote:
My god, the Bridgewater hate is off the charts in this thread... Can we give the coaching staff any benefit of the doubt on evaluating a healthy Bradford vs a healthy Bridgewater when/if the time comes? Teddy did have some part in them winning 11 games and the division in 2015 as a sophomore QB with an offensive line that was similarly atrocious as the one Bradford was working with last season.


But his stats didn't look that good, and the teams offensive ranking was low.


... because he played poorly.

Author:  fiestavike [ Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Mothman wrote:
fiestavike wrote:
Pepper2Moss wrote:
My god, the Bridgewater hate is off the charts in this thread... Can we give the coaching staff any benefit of the doubt on evaluating a healthy Bradford vs a healthy Bridgewater when/if the time comes? Teddy did have some part in them winning 11 games and the division in 2015 as a sophomore QB with an offensive line that was similarly atrocious as the one Bradford was working with last season.


But his stats didn't look that good, and the teams offensive ranking was low.


... because he played poorly.


With all due respect, you base that opinion on the implications of the stats and rankings, not on the actual play, on the actual field, in the actual conditions, and actual situations. All of which helped to contribute to an 11 win season with a less talented team than the one that just went 8-8.

Your emphasis on the "results" seems to depend whether it furthers your argument or gets in the way of it. If the former, its all that matters. If the latter, you retreat to obfuscations about the complexity of all the various factors (which is a fair point). The only way out of that trap is actual knowledge and expertise. But that would tell you that Teddy Bridgewater is actually a damn good QB, which is simply untenable.

Author:  PurpleMustReign [ Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Who hates Teddy? Who said they hated him? I didn't see it. Some have been critical of his play, maybe, and justifiably I might add, but no one has even said they don't like him. Remember, Christian Ponder looked good in the preseason too, and even TJack did too. And who even cares anymore, because the chances of him even being able to run and jump are slim let alone scramble or throw effectively.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

Author:  Mothman [ Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

fiestavike wrote:
With all due respect, you base that opinion on the implications of the stats and rankings, not on the actual play, on the actual field, in the actual conditions, and actual situations.


As I've explained to you before, there's a difference between using stats and rankings as tools to illustrate points about his play and actually basing my opinions exclusively ON those stats and rankings, which I don't do. I've seen every pro game Bridgewater has played, a couple in person. My opinion of his abilities is based primarily on personal observation.

Quote:
The only way out of that trap is actual knowledge and expertise. But that would tell you that Teddy Bridgewater is actually a damn good QB, which is simply untenable.


You're right, the idea that he is a "damn good QB" is untenable. There's too much evidence to the contrary for that assertion to be unassailable.

By what measurable or observable standard is Teddy Bridgewater "a damn good QB" (and keep in mind, either standard requires the consideration of actual results)?

Author:  Mothman [ Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

PurpleMustReign wrote:
Who hates Teddy? Who said they hated him? I didn't see it. Some have been critical of his play, maybe, and justifiably I might add, but no one has even said they don't like him.


That criticism is the "hate", Josh. :(

Author:  fiestavike [ Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

Mothman wrote:

You're right, the idea that he is a "damn good QB" is untenable.


It would be untenable to you regardless of any and all evidence to the contrary.

I don't think there's cause to go much further down this road, because truthfully I don't really believe you are able to make an accurate analysis.

Author:  Mothman [ Wed Apr 26, 2017 10:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Headed toward disaster?

fiestavike wrote:
It would be untenable to you regardless of any and all evidence to the contrary.


That's not true at all. I have nothing personal against Bridgewater. The only problem I've ever had with him is that he isn't actually a "damn good quarterback".

Please stop trying to make this personal.

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