Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

A forum for the hard core Minnesota Vikings fan. Discuss upcoming games, opponents, trades, draft or what ever is on the minds of Viking fans!

Moderator: Moderators

Locked
User avatar
Mothman
Defensive Tackle
Posts: 37379
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2003 11:48 am
Location: Chicago, IL

Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by Mothman » Tue Mar 28, 2017 8:34 am

Here's a link to a Strib article in which Slick Rick expresses confidence in his team, his coaches and his approach:

http://www.startribune.com/vikings-gm-r ... 417256563/
The Vikings haven’t won a playoff game since Brett Favre led them to a 34-3 victory over the Dallas Cowboys on Jan. 17, 2010 — 2,642 days ago. They are 0-3 in playoff games since that day, including one-and-done appearances in the 2012 and 2015 seasons.

With that in mind, Spielman was asked if his faith in his system for building a team ever wavers during these weeks when he interacts face to face with peers who have experienced more tangible successes the past five seasons. The answer came before the question was even completed.

“No,” he said. “I think the biggest thing is you can’t control the uncontrollable. Hopefully we don’t have to go through the adversities that we faced every week last year. That’s part of the business, and you try to adjust the best you can. But I know we have a very talented young core of players on this roster. And we’re still adding talent to it.”

Owners Mark and Zygi Wilf have been coming to these annual meetings since they bought the Vikings from Red McCombs in 2005. As they move among peers who have won one or multiple Super Bowls — i.e. Patriots owner Robert Kraft, who has collected three of his five Lombardi Trophies since ’05 — the Wilfs are 1-4 in the postseason as owners.
I was thinking about the last point the other day, realizing the Vikings won as many playoff games under in their first 3 years under Mike Tice, without a GM and with cheapskate Red McCombs stripping the organization down and preparing to sell it off, as they have in the 12 years since the Wilfs bought the team. :(
“We had a pretty deep roster last year until we got decimated by injuries,” Spielman said of an 8-8 season in which the Vikings used 12 offensive linemen and lost their quarterback for 16 games, star running back for 13 and even their head coach for a prime-time game against the NFC-leading Dallas Cowboys.

“But I think just everybody learned from [going 3-8] after starting out so fast. I think the adversities caught up with us, but as I reflect back on how we handled that … we were still very, very close to being a playoff team even with everything that happened. No one is satisfied. We’re very disappointed. But I think going through that adversity is going to make us stronger.”
Sigh... I see no acknowledgement in that statement of the role management played in what happened last year.

autobon7
All Pro Elite Player
Posts: 1030
Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2015 12:20 pm

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by autobon7 » Tue Mar 28, 2017 11:22 am

Mothman wrote:Here's a link to a Strib article in which Slick Rick expresses confidence in his team, his coaches and his approach:

http://www.startribune.com/vikings-gm-r ... 417256563/
I was thinking about the last point the other day, realizing the Vikings won as many playoff games under in their first 3 years under Mike Tice, without a GM and with cheapskate Red McCombs stripping the organization down and preparing to sell it off, as they have in the 12 years since the Wilfs bought the team. :(
Sigh... I see no acknowledgement in that statement of the role management played in what happened last year.

I agree....the case is mounting (for some time) against Rick. Instead of for Rick.

User avatar
Mothman
Defensive Tackle
Posts: 37379
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2003 11:48 am
Location: Chicago, IL

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by Mothman » Tue Mar 28, 2017 12:30 pm

On a somewhat related note:

Mark Wilf: 'We want our face of the franchise to be a Lombardi Trophy'
Wilf was asked who would replace Peterson as “the face of the franchise,” something the star running back has been since the day he was drafted in 2007.

“We want our face of the franchise to be a Lombardi Trophy,” Wilf said. “That’s what drives us. Obviously, we have a tremendous core of great young talent right down the line. We’re very pleased with our quarterback, Sam Bradford, and on the defensive side with so many great core players. We’re building a roster that has a lot of playmakers.”

User avatar
CbusVikesFan
All Pro Elite Player
Posts: 1395
Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2012 8:07 pm
Location: Columbus, Ohio

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by CbusVikesFan » Tue Mar 28, 2017 2:34 pm

I'm not sure how everyone else feels about it but it seems to me that as soon as mgmt stops being reactive and starts being proactive the Vikings could be a real team to contend with. I see glimpses but not enough to my satisfaction. The drafting has been torturing us for years. I feel it's being turned around but then they draft players that we could have done without.
Image
Don't hate on my Buckeyes. Some of the best Vikings went to Ohio State.
Including now, HOF WR #80 Cris Carter

User avatar
Pondering Her Percy
Hall of Famer
Posts: 5282
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:38 am
Location: Watertown, NY

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Tue Mar 28, 2017 11:07 pm

CbusVikesFan wrote:I'm not sure how everyone else feels about it but it seems to me that as soon as mgmt stops being reactive and starts being proactive the Vikings could be a real team to contend with. I see glimpses but not enough to my satisfaction. The drafting has been torturing us for years. I feel it's being turned around but then they draft players that we could have done without.
I mean who are the guys we could've done without?? I'm sure there might be a couple but I'm hoping you aren't thinking Treadwell and Alexander. Cap is now gone which gives Alexander an opportunity, no less Newman is in his final years. And we had nothing at WR outside of Diggs going into last draft. Nobody expected Thielen to play like he did.
Image

User avatar
chicagopurple
All Pro Elite Player
Posts: 1269
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:45 am

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by chicagopurple » Wed Mar 29, 2017 8:41 am

The team is not deep at any position and has glaring holes at OL. Spielman and Wilf are just talking in meaningless managment language....."blah blah blah" to soothe the fan (cash cows). We have had a number of experienced veterans retire off the defense after good careers. Maybe we will find some rookies can take up their torch, maybe. AP just ended his career, that huge thud you just heard was the end of an era wherein the Vikes wasted a decade of owning one of the best RB in League history without attaining a title, or even coming close except for once. The horrible, worst Ol in the league has been MAYBE upgraded to mediocre, maybe. And we have a QB that might be good but requires protection which so far we have seen no evidence of existing.....we are no where in the class of the title contenders in the NFL. Those of us who had hoped that Spielman would feel the heat of impending unemployment and crafted an aggressive off season of trades are left sitting here facing another season of mediocrity.

User avatar
Pondering Her Percy
Hall of Famer
Posts: 5282
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:38 am
Location: Watertown, NY

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Wed Mar 29, 2017 8:56 am

chicagopurple wrote:The team is not deep at any position and has glaring holes at OL. Spielman and Wilf are just talking in meaningless managment language....."blah blah blah" to soothe the fan (cash cows). We have had a number of experienced veterans retire off the defense after good careers. Maybe we will find some rookies can take up their torch, maybe. AP just ended his career, that huge thud you just heard was the end of an era wherein the Vikes wasted a decade of owning one of the best RB in League history without attaining a title, or even coming close except for once. The horrible, worst Ol in the league has been MAYBE upgraded to mediocre, maybe. And we have a QB that might be good but requires protection which so far we have seen no evidence of existing.....we are no where in the class of the title contenders in the NFL. Those of us who had hoped that Spielman would feel the heat of impending unemployment and crafted an aggressive off season of trades are left sitting here facing another season of mediocrity.
To say this team is not deep at any position is completely false. I'm not going to get into explaining that depth. I'll let you take the time to actually look into it before you post next time. But yup, you're right we're already facing another season of mediocrity when the NFL draft hasnt even hit yet. Makes total sense :roll: These types of posts where you're basically already saying the team is mediocre when the draft hasnt even hit yet are awfully repetitive and very tiring.
Image

User avatar
chicagopurple
All Pro Elite Player
Posts: 1269
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:45 am

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by chicagopurple » Wed Mar 29, 2017 10:48 am

where are we deep?
OL?
DL?
RB??
QB?

perhaps we have a bit of viable depth at WR.....maybe but i am not too convinced yet.

TE? I think this is our stongest position and for a team that will likely have to depend on a dump off short passing gaem I guess TE is critical.....woo hooo!!

Kicker?? maybe thts our "depth"

Coaching staff? NOT....

User avatar
Pondering Her Percy
Hall of Famer
Posts: 5282
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:38 am
Location: Watertown, NY

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Wed Mar 29, 2017 12:03 pm

chicagopurple wrote:where are we deep?
OL?
DL?
RB??
QB?

perhaps we have a bit of viable depth at WR.....maybe but i am not too convinced yet.

TE? I think this is our stongest position and for a team that will likely have to depend on a dump off short passing gaem I guess TE is critical.....woo hooo!!

Kicker?? maybe thts our "depth"

Coaching staff? NOT....
Ok so obviously you didnt look into what I was saying. DL consists of Griffen, Robison, Hunter, Jones, Joseph, Stephen, Johnson and if Floyd can get healthy. Depth.....

And I would saying having CBs of Rhodes, Waynes, Newman and Alexander is fairly deep.

But lets think about all this repetitive grumbling you're doing regarding depth. For like the 5th time, the draft still hasnt happened yet. You're adding "RB" up there when we have TWO RBs on our roster. Do you really think we're going into next year with two RBs? We currently have TWO active QBs. Do you think we're going into next year with only two QBs?? I mean what are you really trying to prove here?? This isnt even close to being a final roster and you're saying there is no depth. No less I just named 2 positions that have good depth. Man oh man :confused:
Image

mansquatch
Hall of Fame Candidate
Posts: 3456
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2005 2:44 pm
Location: Coon Rapids, MN

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by mansquatch » Wed Mar 29, 2017 1:27 pm

My question for those saying Spielman is good or bad is this: As compared to what?

If your conclusion is that we are not deep, then I ask as compared to what? How do you know we are not deep? It would seem to me that a logical approach would be to look at how deep other NFL teams are and then use that as a benchmark to compare against the vikings. Otherwise you are just venting a opinion without any basis in reality.

The same holds true for those saying we are deep: As compared to what?
Winning is not a sometime thing it is an all of the time thing - Vince Lombardi

User avatar
chicagopurple
All Pro Elite Player
Posts: 1269
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2012 10:45 am

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by chicagopurple » Wed Mar 29, 2017 5:28 pm

waynes and rhodes are a good pair, Newman is getting longer in the tooth and shouldnt be expected to be a top notch player.
I am not convinced that either RB is a quality starter.....that remains to be proven

we have ONE QB....as most teams nowadays do.....Teddy is a huge unknown who never proved much and is now very likely far more limited then a goon squad of back ups.

and all those other position that you fail to review......OL, wide reciever, etc etc are all rather questionable

Sorry, I have been a Vikes fan for 45 yrs......a plan that aims for a shot at mediocre just isnt good enough.

Spielman is spouting platitudes

Yes we have a draft coming, but its a draft short on OL talent and lots of teams looking for OL help. The draft is a crap shoot and what talent you DO get is likely to spend a few years on the bench learning, especially with Zim as the coach who has an aversion to playing rookies .

User avatar
CbusVikesFan
All Pro Elite Player
Posts: 1395
Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2012 8:07 pm
Location: Columbus, Ohio

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by CbusVikesFan » Wed Mar 29, 2017 9:34 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: I mean who are the guys we could've done without?? I'm sure there might be a couple but I'm hoping you aren't thinking Treadwell and Alexander. Cap is now gone which gives Alexander an opportunity, no less Newman is in his final years. And we had nothing at WR outside of Diggs going into last draft. Nobody expected Thielen to play like he did.
Aaay, forget about it! TREADWELL is a.........underachieving lazy bust, I mean butt! Just like Patterson. You can hold your opinion :bowdown: and tell me how stupid I am :confused: and give me your best arguments :sleep: but until otherwise shown, he is in that category. POOF! :rock:
Image
Don't hate on my Buckeyes. Some of the best Vikings went to Ohio State.
Including now, HOF WR #80 Cris Carter

User avatar
Pondering Her Percy
Hall of Famer
Posts: 5282
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2012 3:38 am
Location: Watertown, NY

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Thu Mar 30, 2017 8:10 am

CbusVikesFan wrote: Aaay, forget about it! TREADWELL is a.........underachieving lazy bust, I mean butt! Just like Patterson. You can hold your opinion :bowdown: and tell me how stupid I am :confused: and give me your best arguments :sleep: but until otherwise shown, he is in that category. POOF! :rock:
Ok you can pump the brakes on all the little sarcastic remarks anytime now.

And I suppose you're just in that category of just not knowing what a bust is or what it entails. I dont see anyone running around saying Jared Goff is a bust. Hmm... probably because you dont just give a player their rookie year to prove if they're a bust or not. And where does "lazy" come from?? I'm pretty sure he was the one WR on our roster that was literally on the jugs machine every day after practice. That is the complete opposite of lazy. But either way, if Laquon Treadwell is a "bust" then what's Christian Ponder?? Ryan Leaf?? Jamarcus Russell? Troy Williamson?? A super bust? A mega bust? What do they classify that as? Because they got way more opportunity than Treadwell. Like I said, if you're classifying a rookie as a bust after his rookie year where he only logged 80 snaps, then you proved to me you really dont understand what a bust is. So just take the sarcasm somewhere else and just move on.
Last edited by Pondering Her Percy on Thu Mar 30, 2017 9:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
Image

User avatar
Mothman
Defensive Tackle
Posts: 37379
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2003 11:48 am
Location: Chicago, IL

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by Mothman » Thu Mar 30, 2017 8:45 am

Don't make me pull this car over.

mansquatch
Hall of Fame Candidate
Posts: 3456
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2005 2:44 pm
Location: Coon Rapids, MN

Re: Rick Spielman hasn't lost faith in himself or his system

Post by mansquatch » Thu Mar 30, 2017 9:33 am

This went off the rails in a hurry...

Here is my take on the roster:

Offense:
RB: At the moment feels decent, perhaps even competitive. We have two players who can play all three down in Murray and McKinnon.

QB: The backup situation is ugly, but I'm inclined to give them a pass since they are barely 7 months removed from the Teddy injury. The fact we have Bradford at all is probably a hat tip to Spielman.

WR: Diggs, Thielen, and Wright are a legitimate top 3 WR corps. We lack a true Alpha #1, but so do most teams. (The Patriots have no alpha WR and just won the SB against a team with the best WR in the NFL.) Past those three is the Treadwell question mark and some developmental guys. That isn't a bad situation IMO, however we currently lack a true red zone presence within this group. This is a natural fit for Treadwell, so again, can he make strides this offseason? If he can, it will mean very big things for our offense.

TE: Rudolph might be on the most important guys on the team given the lack of a redzone threat. Hopefully he can continue to improve. The new guy they singed (his name escapes me) should also help. I liked Ellison, but mostly he was a blocker, so let us hope that we do not miss that so much. (See next section...)

OL: Still the weakest group on the roster, but better than it was before free agency started. Still no definitive starter at RG. Backup situation at tackle is questionable (Sirles/Hill) to ugly (Clemmings.) Internal line has some positives lower on the depth chart at Kerin (SP?) and Easton. It is worth asking a question here though: How many teams can go 12 deep at OL like the Vikings had to in 2016 and be competitive? I'm going to venture a guess that the answer is ZERO. The place to rip Spielman is the solutions at starter (Kalil/Fusco/Loadholt/Harris/Smith/Sullivan) that lead to the debacle. Worth noting that every single member of that laundry list is off the roster. 6 OL in one offseason! This group still scares me. I think they'll be better than what we saw in 2016, but if injuries hit at tackle again we could be in trouble. It's not a one season fix. Hopefully they are able to add some reasonable depth here in the draft.

Defense:
CB: Probably the deepest group on the team. Losing Munnerlyn will sting some, but Rhodes/Newman/Waynes/Alexander is a solid group and likey as good at this position as any roster in the NFL.

S: Smith is a top 3 safety and probably competes for #1 depening on the role he is playing with the guys in Seasttle. Sandejo has become a solid role player. Some young talent beneath that is still inconsistent. Still I'd rate this group as very strong in the NFL. Finding good safeties at the NFL level is very hard. We are fortunate to have what we have here.

LB: Kendricks/Barr are as good in Nickel as anyone in the NFL IMO. The 3rd guy in the 4-3 is a bit of question with the retirement of Greenway. Not sure about the other guys. Might be a candidate for some depth?

DT: Joseph is fantastic. Tom Johnson isn't bad either. Floyd is an injury concern. They've added Datone Jones. I'd say we've got decent depth here.

DE: Robison/Griffen/Hunter are great. Behind them the talent isn't as strong, but still we've get the solid DE. Depth isn't terrible here.


For me the issue is mostly the same as last year. Can the OL put together a complete season and not completely hamper the team due to injuries? I want to think that having both tackles on IR is abnormal, but we've had so much injury trouble with this position group that it is hard to imagine in not being the case. Then again, three of the major injury bug culprits the last three years were Loadholt, Kalil, and Fusco, all of whom are no longer on the team. In addition we've seen AP not play 2 out of the past three seasons. Hopefully having consistency at RB will also help the offense.

I'm excited for what Bradford can bring to the table with his accuracy and deep ball if we can provide him with some protection. We do not have a dominant WR, but the guys we do have a sneaky and productive. A major question will be if they can get over the hump in the Red Zone and start being productive. If that happens, this team will be a contender given the quality of the defense.
Winning is not a sometime thing it is an all of the time thing - Vince Lombardi

Locked