Toxic Leadership

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Pondering Her Percy
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Tue Mar 14, 2017 3:12 pm

fiestavike wrote: Probably my lease favorite member of the Vikings organization ever, with the exception of Darren Sharper.
Agreed. I couldn't stand Chilly. I was a huge Sharper fan when he was here. I have his jersey and would never wear it again because of the hate I have for him when he went to the Saints and was involved in the bounty plus the fact that he raped more women than Bill Cosby
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by PurpleMustReign » Tue Mar 14, 2017 5:38 pm

I didn't mean here necessarily, but he did judge talent for his scheme quite well.

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by fiestavike » Tue Mar 14, 2017 6:29 pm

PurpleMustReign wrote:I didn't mean here necessarily, but he did judge talent for his scheme quite well.

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Other than Favre circa 2009, I wouldn't agree.

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Boon
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Boon » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:43 pm

Why do people continue to defend turner like he was some kind of savior that left mid season when the team had the best offense? You guys act like he didn't run the chargers into the ground, the browns after that and then the vikings. Dude left because he was gonna get fired for having damn near the worst offense in the last qtr century. It was downright abysmal. Given that, i find it hard to believe that he left due to something bad behind the scenes when zimmer was almost in tears the day after he left.


Turner is just bad, thats why he left instead of being fired

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Boon
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Boon » Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:47 pm

Not only that, find me one past defensive player on any team zimmer has been on that has said anything actually bad about him or how he leads. Or how his practices are too much. Past players who have nothing to hold back. Because i havent seen a single one. Gimme a break. Ellison's dad is just salty for whatever reason. He went and chased a check because the vikings wouldnt pay him 8 mil a year like the giants. He is literally making 1 mil less a year than kelce and gronk. 2 more mil a year than rudolph. Lets be real here

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by MountainGirl » Thu Mar 16, 2017 3:33 am

Boon wrote:Not only that, find me one past defensive player on any team zimmer has been on that has said anything actually bad about him or how he leads. Or how his practices are too much. Past players who have nothing to hold back. Because i havent seen a single one. Gimme a break. Ellison's dad is just salty for whatever reason. He went and chased a check because the vikings wouldnt pay him 8 mil a year like the giants. He is literally making 1 mil less a year than kelce and gronk. 2 more mil a year than rudolph. Lets be real here
Agreed. Zim's players love him. Also, what is it lately with grown men having their Daddies complain for them?

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Boon » Thu Mar 16, 2017 5:02 am

MountainGirl wrote: Agreed. Zim's players love him. Also, what is it lately with grown men having their Daddies complain for them?
Pretty sure they're not putting them up to it lol.

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Texas Vike » Thu Mar 16, 2017 2:30 pm

MountainGirl wrote: Agreed. Zim's players love him. Also, what is it lately with grown men having their Daddies complain for them?

:lol:

Helicopter parents.

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Demi » Thu Mar 16, 2017 6:44 pm

Turner is just bad, thats why he left instead of being fired
And because the front office didn't have the balls to fire him. instead they hire a bum whose only success came as Chip Kelly's lap dog. :wallbang:

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Pondering Her Percy
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Thu Mar 16, 2017 8:55 pm

Demi wrote: And because the front office didn't have the balls to fire him. instead they hire a bum whose only success came as Chip Kelly's lap dog. :wallbang:
When would we have fired him? Because we lost two games in a row? Even the year before our offense wasn't great but we were still 11-5. We didn't necessarily need to fire him :confused:
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by J. Kapp 11 » Thu Mar 16, 2017 11:47 pm

Mothman wrote: That's not what he said. He said:

"It's something people may not understand. It's not me against somebody else. The situation was such ... I don't think I could get done the things we needed to get done. It wasn't something you just wake up and decide. It's been building. It wasn't going to work with me. So let me get out of the way and let them have a chance to make it work."

I think it's important to acknowledge his obvious effort to be diplomatic and to understand that leaving midseason was surprisingly out of character for Turner. He made a point of saying it was a "building" situation. I think the key to understanding what happened probably lies in that comment and in his remark that "I don't think I could get done the things we needed to get done". Why? That comment sure makes it sound like an untenable situation was allowed to develop within the organization and led to Turner stepping aside.

From the same article linked to above:
That sure looks to me like a diplomatic way to say things were messed up within the organization.


That's letting the people actually involved in those losses off the hook pretty easily. The players and coaches involved in the last 9 games had something to do with the outcomes.
How about we look at what he actually said and leave out what we think he must have meant?

He said, "It wasn't going to work WITH ME."

He also said, "Sometimes, you feel like you might be holding them back, holding them back from things all getting on the same page. I don't want anyone to think I was bailing. It just wasn't working."

Sorry Norv, but even though you said you don't want anyone to think you were bailing, YOU BAILED. You quit. Period. You freaking quit. I don't care what the situation is, you don't just quit. Unrest, schmunrest. You quit. Good luck getting hired again.
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by autobon7 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 10:20 am

Demi wrote: And because the front office didn't have the balls to fire him. instead they hire a bum whose only success came as Chip Kelly's lap dog. :wallbang:
I wouldn't necessarily label Shurmur as a bum. I feel like he is/will be an upgrade over Turner but that remains to be seen as the sample size with the Vikings is too small to fairly compare.

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Demi » Fri Mar 17, 2017 11:44 pm

autobon7 wrote: I wouldn't necessarily label Shurmur as a bum. I feel like he is/will be an upgrade over Turner but that remains to be seen as the sample size with the Vikings is too small to fairly compare.
Vikings sample size was too small. But before that, he had two solid seasons when Chip Kelly ran the offense. And a half dozen bottom of the leagues seasons when he ran the offense.

Last season when he took over? I saw what looked like a college offense...not an offense that could win in the NFL...

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Laserman » Mon Mar 20, 2017 9:32 pm

simply put, the game passed Norv by, as it has with many great coaches, It eventually passes every coach by. It will even pass Belicheck by too.

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by fiestavike » Wed Mar 22, 2017 11:27 am

Zimmer tried to call Riki Ellison. Riki did not return his call. :lol:

via Zimmer on PA's show.

I love Zimmer.

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Wed Mar 22, 2017 11:44 am

fiestavike wrote:Zimmer tried to call Riki Ellison. Riki did not return his call. :lol:

via Zimmer on PA's show.

I love Zimmer.

:lol: Yeah I just read that last night. I would have loved to hear that conversation
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Just Me » Wed Mar 22, 2017 4:57 pm

Maybe Riki did lose that number... :P

(Plagiarized joke, but I couldn't pass it up!)
I've told people a million times not to exaggerate!

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by fiestavike » Wed Mar 22, 2017 5:22 pm

Just Me wrote:Maybe Riki did lose that number... :P

(Plagiarized joke, but I couldn't pass it up!)
That's good.

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by PsyDanny » Wed Mar 22, 2017 8:36 pm

Just Me wrote:Maybe Riki did lose that number... :P

(Plagiarized joke, but I couldn't pass it up!)

Didn't happen to see that on yesterdays Facebook KFAN thread on Mr. Riki?

'Cuz if you did...
"My anterior orifice is forever causing me extreme difficulty;
therefore, I shall endeavor to acquire some self-control."

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Boon
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Boon » Wed Mar 22, 2017 11:19 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: When would we have fired him? Because we lost two games in a row? Even the year before our offense wasn't great but we were still 11-5. We didn't necessarily need to fire him :confused:

Striving for mediocrity will bite you

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Pondering Her Percy
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Wed Mar 22, 2017 11:45 pm

Boon wrote:

Striving for mediocrity will bite you
....because thats what I'm doing :confused:
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Just Me
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Just Me » Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:42 am

PsyDanny wrote:
Didn't happen to see that on yesterdays Facebook KFAN thread on Mr. Riki?

'Cuz if you did...
Actually saw it here: http://www.dailynorseman.com/2017/3/21/ ... s-comments

(Hence, my disclaimer about the joke being "plagiarized" - Just thought it was funny)

Was it you that posted it originally?
I've told people a million times not to exaggerate!

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by PsyDanny » Thu Mar 23, 2017 10:02 am

Just Me wrote: Actually saw it here: http://www.dailynorseman.com/2017/3/21/ ... s-comments

(Hence, my disclaimer about the joke being "plagiarized" - Just thought it was funny)

Was it you that posted it originally?
I did not post to that page, but to a KFAN tread on Facebook.

While it is possible that someone saw my post then carried it on to that thread, it is just as likely that another Steely Dan fan had the same brilliant idea!
"My anterior orifice is forever causing me extreme difficulty;
therefore, I shall endeavor to acquire some self-control."

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Just Me » Thu Mar 23, 2017 3:56 pm

That was funny! (Good job on coming up with that!)
I've told people a million times not to exaggerate!

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Boon » Sat Mar 25, 2017 3:05 am

Pondering Her Percy wrote: ....because thats what I'm doing :confused:
Not a personal attack by any means, but I get the feeling you just like arguing. Because saying they went 11-5 the year before, and still had the 29th ranked offense, then questioning why they would fire him after two losses, when the team was now ranked 32nd in offense at the time of his "leaving", is striving for mediocrity. Keeping him there after 27, 29, and 32nd (at the time) nfl offensive yardage rankings is striving for mediocrity. Keeping an offensive coordinator who has a bottom feeder offense despite having the third ranked yardage defense, 7th in turnovers, and 6th ranked scoring defense , is striving for mediocrity. why fire him? you ask that and then try to use sarcasm to deflect something you JUST STATED

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Sun Mar 26, 2017 10:24 pm

Boon wrote:
Not a personal attack by any means, but I get the feeling you just like arguing. Because saying they went 11-5 the year before, and still had the 29th ranked offense, then questioning why they would fire him after two losses, when the team was now ranked 32nd in offense at the time of his "leaving", is striving for mediocrity. Keeping him there after 27, 29, and 32nd (at the time) nfl offensive yardage rankings is striving for mediocrity. Keeping an offensive coordinator who has a bottom feeder offense despite having the third ranked yardage defense, 7th in turnovers, and 6th ranked scoring defense , is striving for mediocrity. why fire him? you ask that and then try to use sarcasm to deflect something you JUST STATED
No I don't like "just arguing". I don't come on here to argue. But when was the last time you saw a coach get fired shortly after starting a season 5-0?? I don't think that has ever happened to be honest. I never said the offense was doing good under him. But at the same time, you don't see a coach get fired when the team is doing well. And for our offense at that time, the running game was still terrible but the passing game was doing fairly well. When we were 5-0 Bradford was averaging 250 a game and had 6 TDs and 0 INTs in 4 games. Just because we have 2 bad games in a row offensively doesnt warrant any coach getting fired. Especially when you're 5-2. It just doesnt happen.
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by chicagopurple » Mon Mar 27, 2017 8:57 am

Not necessarily true, AND the hot start we got out to was 90% due to a great defensive effort carrying an anemic offense. We won those 5 games despite the poor offense, not because of a good offense. Eventually, our defense fatigued out and couldnt cover up the atrocious excuse for an offense that we had and the tailspin began. Not all of this is due to the OC, heck, very little of it was. No OC could win with the sad excuse for a OL he was given, or the RB by committee of back-ups, etc.

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Pondering Her Percy » Mon Mar 27, 2017 11:37 am

chicagopurple wrote:Not necessarily true, AND the hot start we got out to was 90% due to a great defensive effort carrying an anemic offense. We won those 5 games despite the poor offense, not because of a good offense. Eventually, our defense fatigued out and couldnt cover up the atrocious excuse for an offense that we had and the tailspin began. Not all of this is due to the OC, heck, very little of it was. No OC could win with the sad excuse for a OL he was given, or the RB by committee of back-ups, etc.
Of course the D was playing great but the offense wasnt that bad at all during that stretch. Especially the passing game. Running game was bad. But to say the offense was anemic in the first five games I disagree with. I would say bad running game and solid pass game. That doesnt define anemic
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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by chicagopurple » Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:12 pm

Yes it does....because any quality team you face will shut you down if you are that unbalanced. Moreover, the passing game wasnt great....it was better then last year but still the deep game was not on track. You forget that the QB was constantly getting pressured and dumping off short passes because he got NO time to let a play develop.

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Re: Toxic Leadership

Post by Mothman » Mon Mar 27, 2017 7:12 pm

Pondering Her Percy wrote: Of course the D was playing great but the offense wasnt that bad at all during that stretch. Especially the passing game. Running game was bad. But to say the offense was anemic in the first five games I disagree with. I would say bad running game and solid pass game. That doesnt define anemic

I think you're forgetting how much the offense struggled to score in at least 3 of those first 5 games. They didn't score a TD in week 1, managing only 4 FGs. They scored 17 in week 2 against GB. They scored just one TD and 2 FGs @Carolina. They were productive against the Giants and Texans but those were really the only two games out of the first 5 (or 7, for that matter) in which the offense was very effective.

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