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 QB Sneak 
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Post Re: QB Sneak
Cliff wrote:
You can't squeeze blood out of a turnip. I think it's unquestionable that Davidson had more talent to work with than Sparano does. Specifically with the injuries he's had to deal with.


Cliff, the line absolutely stunk from day one this season, when they delivered an embarrassing performance. It was supposedly upgraded from last year's line by the addition of Boone and Smith but at no point has it actually looked better, even when all 5 projected starters were playing. If we'd seen a decline due to injuries alone I think the "blood from a turnip" argument would carry more weight but it's been ugly from the start. At no point have I seen any indication that Sparano is doing an adequate job or that he's been an upgrade over Davidson (and I didn't think Davidson was a terrific OL coach by any means).

Do any of the players who were on the line last season appear to be improved at all? Do Fusco, Berger or Clemmings look better or worse? Has a single issue we saw with the line early in the season been resolved?

I know Sparano is dealing with a banged up unit but I just don't see anything to suggest he's made a positive difference.


Wed Nov 16, 2016 12:22 pm
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Post Re: QB Sneak
Mothman wrote:
Cliff wrote:
You can't squeeze blood out of a turnip. I think it's unquestionable that Davidson had more talent to work with than Sparano does. Specifically with the injuries he's had to deal with.


Cliff, the line absolutely stunk from day one this season, when they delivered an embarrassing performance. It was supposedly upgraded from last year's line by the addition of Boone and Smith but at no point has it actually looked better, even when all 5 projected starters were playing. If we'd seen a decline due to injuries alone I think the "blood from a turnip" argument would carry more weight but it's been ugly from the start. At no point have I seen any indication that Sparano is doing an adequate job or that he's been an upgrade over Davidson (and I didn't think Davidson was a terrific OL coach by any means).

Do any of the players who were on the line last season appear to be improved at all? Do Fusco, Berger or Clemmings look better or worse? Has a single issue we saw with the line early in the season been resolved?

I know Sparano is dealing with a banged up unit but I just don't see anything to suggest he's made a positive difference.


I don't see anything to suggest he's made a positive or negative difference. It's hard to tell what he's done exactly with the group he has. Likewise I think it's difficult to grade him based on the group he has.

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Wed Nov 16, 2016 12:46 pm
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Post Re: QB Sneak
Cliff wrote:
I don't see anything to suggest he's made a positive or negative difference. It's hard to tell what he's done exactly with the group he has. Likewise I think it's difficult to grade him based on the group he has.


That's why I wrote "I don't know how much of that is on him" after saying his OL has been a disaster. :)


Wed Nov 16, 2016 1:00 pm
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Post Re: QB Sneak
Mothman wrote:
Cliff wrote:
I don't see anything to suggest he's made a positive or negative difference. It's hard to tell what he's done exactly with the group he has. Likewise I think it's difficult to grade him based on the group he has.


That's why I wrote "I don't know how much of that is on him" after saying his OL has been a disaster. :)


Gotcha. The part "the line appears to have taken a serious step backward since the firing of Davidson" implied (to me) that Davidson's departure was a significant reason for the offensive line being bad. I now see you were more using it as a time marker and him leaving *may* be one of the reasons.

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Wed Nov 16, 2016 1:16 pm
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Post Re: QB Sneak
Cliff wrote:
Mothman wrote:
Cliff wrote:
I don't see anything to suggest he's made a positive or negative difference. It's hard to tell what he's done exactly with the group he has. Likewise I think it's difficult to grade him based on the group he has.


That's why I wrote "I don't know how much of that is on him" after saying his OL has been a disaster. :)


Gotcha. The part "the line appears to have taken a serious step backward since the firing of Davidson" implied (to me) that Davidson's departure was a significant reason for the offensive line being bad. I now see you were more using it as a time marker and him leaving *may* be one of the reasons.



Exactly. Sorry, I could have made the point more clearly.


Wed Nov 16, 2016 1:26 pm
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Post Re: QB Sneak
YikesVikes wrote:
5thWave wrote:
S197 wrote:
Maybe they can try a sneak with McKinnon. Line him up in the wildcat then run under center and snap it. He's not a power back but he's going to be better than Bradford and has experience taking snaps under center.


THIS! It gives an extra blocker, and minimizes ball handling. C'mon man!!!!!

Put CP back there, and a heavy body.



The issue would still persist. It is not making the initial block but sustaining them. That's the biggest issue. By the time CP or JK gets to the line, he will be blown up. The QB sneak works great because it is an instant play; snap and you are directly moving forward.


My suggestion was to use JK as the QB. He ran the triple option in college so he's comfortable taking a snap under center.


Wed Nov 16, 2016 1:43 pm
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Post Re: QB Sneak
You cant judge a coach until he has NFL grade players....we dont have that. I would be far more concerned about Spielman dealing and drafting some real players before I start juggling coaches. The lack of talent size and speed is blatant. The coaching question is far more nebulous.


Wed Nov 16, 2016 3:16 pm
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Post Re: QB Sneak
chicagopurple wrote:
You cant judge a coach until he has NFL grade players....we dont have that. I would be far more concerned about Spielman dealing and drafting some real players before I start juggling coaches. The lack of talent size and speed is blatant. The coaching question is far more nebulous.


It is but the juggling is already underway and that's often a bad sign. When the OC resigns mid-season, that's definitely a bad sign.

The Vikings ship is taking on water. Fast.


Wed Nov 16, 2016 3:27 pm
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Post Re: QB Sneak
Lots of Qb sneaks to night.


Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:45 pm
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Post Re: QB Sneak
Mothman wrote:
chicagopurple wrote:
You cant judge a coach until he has NFL grade players....we dont have that. I would be far more concerned about Spielman dealing and drafting some real players before I start juggling coaches. The lack of talent size and speed is blatant. The coaching question is far more nebulous.


It is but the juggling is already underway and that's often a bad sign. When the OC resigns mid-season, that's definitely a bad sign.

The Vikings ship is taking on water. Fast.

So much so that the bailing buckets have holes in them.
But that is what happens when you don't build the team from the inside out. Thanks Rick, you bunghole!

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Fri Nov 18, 2016 7:03 am
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Post Re: QB Sneak
CbusVikesFan wrote:
Mothman wrote:
chicagopurple wrote:
You cant judge a coach until he has NFL grade players....we dont have that. I would be far more concerned about Spielman dealing and drafting some real players before I start juggling coaches. The lack of talent size and speed is blatant. The coaching question is far more nebulous.


It is but the juggling is already underway and that's often a bad sign. When the OC resigns mid-season, that's definitely a bad sign.

The Vikings ship is taking on water. Fast.

So much so that the bailing buckets have holes in them.
But that is what happens when you don't build the team from the inside out. Thanks Rick, you bunghole!


We had a former top 5 pick at LT, A top flight Center, and a former 2nd round pick at RT. I would say we didn't have much to invest in the OL.


Fri Nov 18, 2016 3:21 pm
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Post Re: QB Sneak
Still not 1 QB sneak. It is borderline insanity what we keep doing on these 3rd and 1s. It doesn't work. This game should have been over with early in the 3rd quarter but because we can't seem to pick up 1 yard when we need it, we end up in a battle. Just line up and QB sneak the damn ball. Every good team does it, Rodgers, Brady, Even Manning had a QB sneak from time to time. We keep giving it to Matt and are baffled when he keeps getting stuffed. It's been all season long. Enough is enough!


Mon Dec 12, 2016 8:05 am
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Post Re: QB Sneak
YikesVikes wrote:
Still not 1 QB sneak. It is borderline insanity what we keep doing on these 3rd and 1s. It doesn't work. This game should have been over with early in the 3rd quarter but because we can't seem to pick up 1 yard when we need it, we end up in a battle. Just line up and QB sneak the damn ball. Every good team does it, Rodgers, Brady, Even Manning had a QB sneak from time to time. We keep giving it to Matt and are baffled when he keeps getting stuffed. It's been all season long. Enough is enough!


We've been doing the same thing for years with Peterson, its just that he occassionally made the end zone. But even he often wouldn't. We need more rollouts in those situations. It actually works.

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... a good completion percentage in a performance like that is like putting lipstick on a pig.


Mon Dec 12, 2016 8:51 am
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Post Re: QB Sneak
We should also try a QB draw or roll out when we are at the goal line. It would have caught Jacksonville totally off guard.


Mon Dec 12, 2016 10:53 am
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Post Re: QB Sneak
Maybe line up Cordarrelle Patterson under center for a QB sneak... Bradford has chicken legs.

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Mon Dec 12, 2016 11:58 am
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Post Re: QB Sneak
soflavike wrote:
Maybe line up Cordarrelle Patterson under center for a QB sneak... Bradford has chicken legs.



1. I think Patterson is still being underutilized by our coaching staff, and that is especially true in the red zone (or "Bright Red Zone," within five yards, where we struggle royally). Yesterday they threw a bubble screen to Rudy when they were at the 2. That's a ball that needs to go to Patterson, IMO. Alternatively, I'd be good with that ball going to Thielen or even Treadwell. He's supposedly a beast in YAC; let's see it!

2. Another alternative play to running into our inept line is the sweep we ran some weeks ago with Thielen.

3. On the game winning TD we rolled Sam out and he hit a wide open Rudy in the flat. Great play that used some deception. We'd been running up the gut all day, so JAX thought we would continue that. Also, there was 2:21 or so on the clock. A run play would have let us get down to the 2 minute warning, which appeared to be our primary goal on that drive previous to this more aggressive play. One of the only smart play calls in the red zone all day, IMO.


Mon Dec 12, 2016 12:05 pm
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Post Re: QB Sneak
QB sneak is more about lower body str. Get low fast and just keep pushing. But as soon as anyone is back there other then QB, the D will know something is up. And we arent masters of the sneak. Dead last over the past 10 years i bet.


Tue Dec 13, 2016 1:52 am
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