Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

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Mothman
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Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by Mothman » Mon Oct 24, 2016 2:59 pm

This is a really good article from MMQB/SI's Andy Benoit:

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/10/24/nfl- ... m-bradford

It focuses on the Vikes OL issues but it also addresses why they probably call some of the plays they do and what they may do to compensate for their blocking problems. Unsurprisingly, there's a lot being published about the Vikes OL today but this article is a bit more informative and insightful than most of what I've seen.
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by TSonn » Mon Oct 24, 2016 3:37 pm

Watching other teams like the Steelers, Raiders, Falcons, and Cowboys makes me jealous of their offensive line play. The difference is astounding - especially in pass protection.
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by halfgiz » Mon Oct 24, 2016 4:20 pm

Mothman wrote:This is a really good article from MMQB/SI's Andy Benoit:

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/10/24/nfl- ... m-bradford

It focuses on the Vikes OL issues but it also addresses why they probably call some of the plays they do and what they may do to compensate for their blocking problems. Unsurprisingly, there's a lot being published about the Vikes OL today but this article is a bit more informative and insightful than most of what I've seen.
Good read Jim and a good look at the bigger picture.

The thing is probably next year we will be looking at almost a whole new line.
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by halfgiz » Mon Oct 24, 2016 4:23 pm

TSonn wrote:Watching other teams like the Steelers, Raiders, Falcons, and Cowboys makes me jealous of their offensive line play. The difference is astounding - especially in pass protection.
Why is their line play so much better? Do you think it's talent or coaching?
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by RFIP » Mon Oct 24, 2016 6:11 pm

TSonn wrote:Watching other teams like the Steelers, Raiders, Falcons, and Cowboys makes me jealous of their offensive line play. The difference is astounding - especially in pass protection.
How about the Patriots?

Brady can write a book on must pass pro's!
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by VikingLord » Mon Oct 24, 2016 6:50 pm

Mothman wrote:This is a really good article from MMQB/SI's Andy Benoit:

http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/10/24/nfl- ... m-bradford

It focuses on the Vikes OL issues but it also addresses why they probably call some of the plays they do and what they may do to compensate for their blocking problems. Unsurprisingly, there's a lot being published about the Vikes OL today but this article is a bit more informative and insightful than most of what I've seen.
It's a good article, but...

:sleep: :sleep: :sleep:

Everyone knows this is the Achilles' heel of the Vikings. They've managed to compensate for it prior to yesterday, but Philly found a way to exploit it to a degree that, well, I really don't ever recall seeing in pro football to be honest. That had to have been one the highest numbers of arm-swats I've ever seen given up in a single game.

As I stated in another post, it's a long season and I think the Vikings will resume their winning ways, warts and all. I don't think they'll be able to go very far with this particular wart once they get into the playoffs, but it will still be a nice ride with a lot of impressive wins. This is still a very good team that has room to grow yet, but if they are going to be serious contenders they'll need much better blocking up front.
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by losperros » Tue Oct 25, 2016 11:03 am

This article hits home regarding the lack of overall athleticism among the Vikings OL players. It's been a problem for years.

The OL limits what the skill players can do. They don't have the quickness to help diversify the running game and they probably can't be relied to help a quick strike pass attack either.

I understand Zimmer's frustration. Even when the starters are healthy, the OL is slow and ineffective.
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by Texas Vike » Tue Oct 25, 2016 12:02 pm

On the one hand, I understand Zimmer's frustration. But on the other, he needed to do more (along with Rick) to address what many of us clearly saw as a weakness this past offseason. They used some dubious reasoning, relying on guys with questionable health (Sully, Load, and Kalil) or of questionable quality (Andre Smith, even Boone to a certain extent). Their plan for competition / backups was similarly reliant on third rate talent: undrafted or very late round guys, essentially the top of the NFL's scrap heap. Now Zimmer is talking about not looking for someone to play off the street, but to be honest that approach isn't much different from the one that they have taken in the recent past.

Why draft Treadwell when we have glaring needs at OL? Why even draft Mac Alexander in the second round? As much as I like both of those prospects, we were extremely hard up for a talent infusion at our glaring weakness... but Zimmer and Spielman chose to address it as if it were an unimportant position for success. I really hope they can get their excrement together, otherwise I'll be losing mine if we lose to the Bears.
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by Mothman » Tue Oct 25, 2016 12:06 pm

Texas Vike wrote:On the one hand, I understand Zimmer's frustration. But on the other, he needed to do more (along with Rick) to address what many of us clearly saw as a weakness this past offseason. They used some dubious reasoning, relying on guys with questionable health (Sully, Load, and Kalil) or of questionable quality (Andre Smith, even Boone to a certain extent). Their plan for competition / backups was similarly reliant on third rate talent: undrafted or very late round guys, essentially the top of the NFL's scrap heap. Now Zimmer is talking about not looking for someone to play off the street, but to be honest that approach isn't much different from the one that they have taken in the recent past.

Why draft Treadwell when we have glaring needs at OL? Why even draft Mac Alexander in the second round? As much as I like both of those prospects, we were extremely hard up for a talent infusion at our glaring weakness... but Zimmer and Spielman chose to address it as if it were an unimportant position for success. I really hope they can get their excrement together, otherwise I'll be losing mine if we lose to the Bears.
:appl:
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by Texas Vike » Tue Oct 25, 2016 12:10 pm

Mothman wrote: :appl:
Where's that taking a bow emoji? :lol:

Jim, you and I were among those arguing for this during the offseason (if not before). Why don't Zimmer and Spielman read our takes? :lol:

:soap
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by Mothman » Tue Oct 25, 2016 12:41 pm

Texas Vike wrote:Where's that taking a bow emoji? :lol:

Jim, you and I were among those arguing for this during the offseason (if not before). Why don't Zimmer and Spielman read our takes? :lol:

:soap

It's hard to imagine. You would think they'd be eagerly consuming our every thought on the team! :lol:
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by losperros » Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:46 pm

Mothman wrote:
It's hard to imagine. You would think they'd be eagerly consuming our every thought on the team! :lol:
Hate to burst your bubbles, guys, but the OL has been a major source of need since day one of Zimmer becoming the Vikings head coach. And a bunch of us have been talking about it the past few years. :tongue:

Hard to believe the offensive line's erratic play and questionable depth somehow escaped Zimmer, Norv and the Vikings coaching staff. But it looks as if something along those lines happened.
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by S197 » Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:48 pm

Texas Vike wrote:On the one hand, I understand Zimmer's frustration. But on the other, he needed to do more (along with Rick) to address what many of us clearly saw as a weakness this past offseason. They used some dubious reasoning, relying on guys with questionable health (Sully, Load, and Kalil) or of questionable quality (Andre Smith, even Boone to a certain extent). Their plan for competition / backups was similarly reliant on third rate talent: undrafted or very late round guys, essentially the top of the NFL's scrap heap. Now Zimmer is talking about not looking for someone to play off the street, but to be honest that approach isn't much different from the one that they have taken in the recent past.

Why draft Treadwell when we have glaring needs at OL? Why even draft Mac Alexander in the second round? As much as I like both of those prospects, we were extremely hard up for a talent infusion at our glaring weakness... but Zimmer and Spielman chose to address it as if it were an unimportant position for success. I really hope they can get their excrement together, otherwise I'll be losing mine if we lose to the Bears.
I don't consider 4th round picks "very late round" nor the top of the NFL scrap heap. Lets not forget we got guys like Everson Griffen, Brian Robison, and Stefon Diggs in these areas. Even solid contributors like Shamar Stephen, Adam Thielen and Andrew Sendejo in the late rounds/undrafted. So Clemmings and Beavers shouldn't have been throw away picks, maybe it's a scouting issue?

I don't recall anyone really upset with the Treadwell pick (except me because I wanted Fuller :) but I digress). You could make a case for the Alexander pick, that seemed more like a value than need pick. However, I recall a lot of people wanting a DT like Billings in the 2nd. I know a few wanted a C in what looked like a good class for that position. But a G/C drafted doesn't fix the fact that both our tackles are injured. You make valid points but I think there's a degree of hindsight involved as well. I could be wrong as I'm going off memory but that is the overall vibe I got from the forum during the draft.
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by Cliff » Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:53 pm

S197 wrote: I don't consider 4th round picks "very late round" nor the top of the NFL scrap heap. Lets not forget we got guys like Everson Griffen, Brian Robison, and Stefon Diggs in these areas. Even solid contributors like Shamar Stephen, Adam Thielen and Andrew Sendejo in the late rounds/undrafted. So Clemmings and Beavers shouldn't have been throw away picks, maybe it's a scouting issue?

I don't recall anyone really upset with the Treadwell pick (except me because I wanted Fuller :) but I digress). You could make a case for the Alexander pick, that seemed more like a value than need pick. However, I recall a lot of people wanting a DT like Billings in the 2nd. I know a few wanted a C in what looked like a good class for that position. But a G/C drafted doesn't fix the fact that both our tackles are injured. You make valid points but I think there's a degree of hindsight involved as well. I could be wrong as I'm going off memory but that is the overall vibe I got from the forum during the draft.
On draft day we thought we still had Sullivan at Center, Loadholt was supposed to come back at RT, and Kalil wasn't on IR. The need for linemen was still obvious ... but not quite so glaring.
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Re: Andy Benoit: Vikings Have a Big Problem

Post by S197 » Tue Oct 25, 2016 2:09 pm

Cliff wrote: On draft day we thought we still had Sullivan at Center, Loadholt was supposed to come back at RT, and Kalil wasn't on IR. The need for linemen was still obvious ... but not quite so glaring.
Exactly. Losing Harris was also a huge blow. If he were here, perhaps they could kick Boone out to LT and use Sirles or Long on the right side. Not many teams are going to survive 4 injuries on their line.
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