Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

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Mothman
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by Mothman » Mon Oct 24, 2016 9:17 am

UKno1VIKING wrote:In a nutshell Zimmer personally did Bradford a favour keeping him in. He gained a little bit back from the TD pass, and pulling him would of been the icing on the cake for the home fans. Hopefully, he can take a bit of momentum from the Patterson TD to Monday night.
However, i do agree that it would of been in the interests of the team if he'd of been pulled. One hit and our season gets a lot harder to pull off.
It's a tough one. But i would always take the decision of Zimmer over anyone every time.
That's a somewhat contradictory answer. :)

Personally, while I understand Zimmer's mentality, I think it was needlessly risky to have Bradford in there so late, still taking hits with game well out of reach.
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by UKno1VIKING » Mon Oct 24, 2016 10:21 am

Mothman wrote: That's a somewhat contradictory answer. :)

Personally, while I understand Zimmer's mentality, I think it was needlessly risky to have Bradford in there so late, still taking hits with game well out of reach.
I don't think it is. I was saying that from Bradford's perspective, Zimmer did him a favour.
For me, i agree with you, i'd much ratrher he be fit and healthy for next week and beyond.
But i am not one to second guess Zimmer. The man is the best head coach i've seen in the 20 years of following this bunch of heartbreakers.
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by S197 » Mon Oct 24, 2016 1:27 pm

Mothman wrote: That's a somewhat contradictory answer. :)

Personally, while I understand Zimmer's mentality, I think it was needlessly risky to have Bradford in there so late, still taking hits with game well out of reach.
I think this is a bit of a unique situation where you've had a guy on the team for a little over a month and probably could use the reps. In this situation, I don't mind keeping him in.
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by Mothman » Mon Oct 24, 2016 1:42 pm

UKno1VIKING wrote:I don't think it is. I was saying that from Bradford's perspective, Zimmer did him a favour.
For me, i agree with you, i'd much ratrher he be fit and healthy for next week and beyond.
But i am not one to second guess Zimmer. The man is the best head coach i've seen in the 20 years of following this bunch of heartbreakers.
I understand where you're coming from. I was just giving you a hard time because "it would of been in the interests of the team if he'd of been pulled" is basically the opposite of what Zimmer actually decided to do. :) However, I get it. You trust his judgment.
S197 wrote:I think this is a bit of a unique situation where you've had a guy on the team for a little over a month and probably could use the reps. In this situation, I don't mind keeping him in.
No offense intended but that seems like a stretch to me. One or two extra series against the Eagles weren't likely to make a difference in the big picture... unless, of course, they had resulted in an injury. Bradford can more safely get the reps in practice and/or in post-practice work with his receivers.

I think Zimmer stubbornly made a bad call. It's a "tough guy" choice that's in his DNA and the football neanderthal in me loves that mentality but they obviously gave up a 1st round pick (and more) for Bradford because they felt they needed someone better than Hill to get them where they wanted to go this season. Consequently, it makes little sense to risk his health needlessly late in an inevitable loss.
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by S197 » Mon Oct 24, 2016 1:59 pm

Mothman wrote:
No offense intended but that seems like a stretch to me. One or two extra series against the Eagles weren't likely to make a difference in the big picture... unless, of course, they had resulted in an injury. Bradford can more safely get the reps in practice and/or in post-practice work with his receivers.

I think Zimmer stubbornly made a bad call. It's a "tough guy" choice that's in his DNA and the football neanderthal in me loves that mentality but they obviously gave up a 1st round pick (and more) for Bradford because they felt they needed someone better than Hill to get them where they wanted to go this season. Consequently, it makes little sense to risk his health needlessly late in an inevitable loss.
There's simply some things you can't replicate in practice, I've heard QBs say that over and over. Players in general actually. You always hear about guys who look great in practice but do nothing on the field. Bradford looked out of sync with his receivers and clearly rattled by the hits. But it is what it is, and he was able to put together a scoring drive, which I think was big and hopefully something they can take a look at and build on.
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by VikingLord » Mon Oct 24, 2016 7:00 pm

Demi wrote: Maybe not. But maybe they knew he was gunshy and reacted to pressure more?
Or they knew the offensive line was garbage and if sent extra rushers it could cause trouble.
:confused:
With this defense it's frustrating to see an offensive performance like this with the one dimensional teams we've put up with over the last decade or more, that's for sure. :wallbang:
Is there such a thing as a zero-dimensional offense, because that is what I saw yesterday.
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by VikingLord » Mon Oct 24, 2016 7:03 pm

Mothman wrote:I'm wondering how people feel about Zimmer's decision to keep Bradford in the game after it was out of reach on Sunday. This is from Jim Souhan's column:
I love the fact that Bradford, Asiata, and the rest of the offense were hyped up at the end and still gave a darn, but given the rash of injuries this team has faced on offense, I think Zimmer was spitting into the wind with that move. It's nice the Vikings finally did score, but heck, the way it was going it might have been smart to pull Bradford after the first 3 drives - he was getting hit that much.
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by Mothman » Tue Oct 25, 2016 8:20 am

VikingLord wrote: I love the fact that Bradford, Asiata, and the rest of the offense were hyped up at the end and still gave a darn, but given the rash of injuries this team has faced on offense, I think Zimmer was spitting into the wind with that move. It's nice the Vikings finally did score, but heck, the way it was going it might have been smart to pull Bradford after the first 3 drives - he was getting hit that much.
:lol: Well said.
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by Cliff » Tue Oct 25, 2016 11:38 am

At what point do you stop? Is Bradford the only one who gets that treatment? If we're going to sit one player to be cautious then why not all of the starters?

I think it's a "give up" move when Zimmer's mantra is to keep fighting.
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by Mothman » Tue Oct 25, 2016 12:05 pm

Cliff wrote:At what point do you stop? Is Bradford the only one who gets that treatment? If we're going to sit one player to be cautious then why not all of the starters?
They aren't all equally important to the team's success but sure, it wouldn't be a bad idea in that situation to sit other key players or even just put in the second team.
I think it's a "give up" move when Zimmer's mantra is to keep fighting.
That's obviously his preference and as I said, the football neanderthal in me approves but the game was literally out of reach. A point was reached where fighting on with the starters wasn't going to change the final outcome. Again, they desperately traded two draft picks, one a first rounder and the other possibly as high as a second rounder, to acquire Bradford because they didn't want to play out this season with just the other QBs on their roster. Why risk his health late in an inevitable loss in which he's already been taken a beating? It's great to "fight on" but is that worth jeopardizing a player they were desperate to acquire and putting themselves right back in the position they were in before they made the trade, just to maintain a tough guy mentality?
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by Purple Reign » Tue Oct 25, 2016 5:31 pm

halfgiz wrote:According to ESPN Stats and Information, - the Eagles sent a defensive back as a pass rusher on 13 of Sam Bradford's dropbacks, the same number as the Eagles' total from the first five games of the season. On those plays, the Eagles sacked or pressured Bradford on 8 dropbacks.

http://www.espn.com/espn/now?nowId=21-0 ... 55038150-4

That would explain why Sam got hit a lot of times by guys coming in untouched.
I guess I don't agree that 'explains why'. Normally the defense has 4 linemen to rush so if you add 1 db then that makes 5 rushers. The offense has 5 blockers to protect the passer (and sometimes more when a back or tight end stays in to block). Pass rushers should never be untouched in a 5 on 5 situation. Now if they sent more pass rushers than blockers, then I can see it but just sending one extra db should be picked up.
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by VikingLord » Tue Oct 25, 2016 5:44 pm

Purple Reign wrote: I guess I don't agree that 'explains why'. Normally the defense has 4 linemen to rush so if you add 1 db then that makes 5 rushers. The offense has 5 blockers to protect the passer (and sometimes more when a back or tight end stays in to block). Pass rushers should never be untouched in a 5 on 5 situation. Now if they sent more pass rushers than blockers, then I can see it but just sending one extra db should be picked up.
Another aspect, and I think where Zimmer's comment about them being "soft" at least partially came from, was the inability of the Vikings tackles to shove the outside rush up and past the QB. That inability to disrupt the edge rushers sufficiently was what allowed all of the arm swats, which is something that maybe happens once per game and at most twice, but which Philly managed to do at least 4 times fairly clean. So it wasn't like Philly had a clean extra rusher taking a direct shot most of the time, but rather found a way to get a rusher to pressure from the backside a lot of the time. That's clearly on the tackles to get locked onto those edge rushers and force them up the field if they're taking that bonsai edge rush, plus on the offensive coordinator to get them some help if he sees them struggling to do that for whatever reason.
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by Cliff » Thu Oct 27, 2016 1:13 pm

Mothman wrote: They aren't all equally important to the team's success but sure, it wouldn't be a bad idea in that situation to sit other key players or even just put in the second team.
That's obviously his preference and as I said, the football neanderthal in me approves but the game was literally out of reach. A point was reached where fighting on with the starters wasn't going to change the final outcome. Again, they desperately traded two draft picks, one a first rounder and the other possibly as high as a second rounder, to acquire Bradford because they didn't want to play out this season with just the other QBs on their roster. Why risk his health late in an inevitable loss in which he's already been taken a beating? It's great to "fight on" but is that worth jeopardizing a player they were desperate to acquire and putting themselves right back in the position they were in before they made the trade, just to maintain a tough guy mentality?
I'm not sure the team overall has an identity without maintaining that mentality. I imagine from a leadership perspective it's difficult to preach "Be tough" and then say "except Sam, he's a bit fragile and we're screwed without him".
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by halfgiz » Fri Oct 28, 2016 4:28 pm

#Vikings K Blair Walsh: "The lack of effort thing that pisses me off Anyone who thinks that they’re wrong To question my effort that sucks."
1:02 PM - 28 Oct 2016

http://www.twincities.com/2016/10/28/vi ... josh-huff/

Maybe he should spend a week with the defense learning how to tackle. :rofl:
That was one lousy excuse for a tackle on that kick return.
Just hit him!!!! :lol:
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Re: Viking @ Eagles Game Day Discussion Thread -- Week 7

Post by halfgiz » Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:37 pm

Vikings guard Alex Boone was fined $12,154 for unsportsmanlike conduct in Philly. Had words for referee after a holding call.
That's a lot of money for the F bomb :beerock:
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