Kluwe rips Frazier, Spielman, Priefer

[Funkytown]

I speculated about Priefer's reasons for lying. I didn't excuse his lies or approve of them.

Well, it most certainly comes off that way. I thought you were trying to justify his lying. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

You have stepped WAY over the line with that comment and I hope you'll apologize.

Seriously? Context. I wasn't serious. That wasn't as personal as it appeared. I didn't mean it the way you are taking it. Why are you so offended? Do you want to argue context? Are you going to be able to tell me what I meant when I said it? Now maybe you see my point of how crappy and weak the argument of context really is. Even though I didn't mean it how you are taking it, that doesn't mean you are wrong for taking it that way. Regardless, the first part of that comment was just a general statement even though I used the word "you." I was just generally speaking. And the second part, well, I thought you were making excuses for his lying. Which, yes, would mean that I value honesty more than you do. It was all just a misunderstanding, Kluwe. Still love ya, though.

[Funkytown]

Did my usual back-road digging on this today. Sounds like there is a good possibility the report is worse than just Priefer's "nuke the gays" comment. It's all vague but it appears that some other higher ups could be in hot water with this report.

Which is going to be super annoying, but I don't blame Kluwe. This whole thing could have been squashed a long time ago if people knew what the heck they were doing.

It's really embarrassing...

[Raptorman]

Americans are a very forgiving group of people. If you said something, or did something your best option is to just admit it, say you made a mistake, look for some help and move on. When you lie about something, anything, people have a tendency to get ticked off. If Priefer had just done that,(assuming of course that he said it, and it sounds like he might have.) this would have been over 7 months ago and Kluwe would be a non issue right now.

[Funkytown]

Americans are a very forgiving group of people. If you said something, or did something your best option is to just admit it, say you made a mistake, look for some help and move on. When you lie about something, anything, people have a tendency to get ticked off. If Priefer had just done that,(assuming of course that he said it, and it sounds like he might have.) this would have been over 7 months ago and Kluwe would be a non issue right now.

That's where I'm at with it, too.

[Mothman]

Well, it most certainly comes off that way. I thought you were trying to justify his lying. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

I think all you've done is underline it's significance. When I use the word context, I'm not simply talking about how someone meant something they wrote or said. Context is the circumstances that form the setting for an event, statement, or idea, and in terms of which it can be fully understood and assessed.

Even though I didn't mean it how you are taking it, that doesn't mean you are wrong for taking it that way. Regardless, the first part of that comment was just a general statement even though I used the word "you." I was just generally speaking. And the second part, well, I thought you were making excuses for his lying. Which, yes, would mean that I value honesty more than you do. It was all just a misunderstanding, Kluwe. Still love ya, though.

I don't see an apology in there.

[Funkytown]

I think all you've done is underline it's significance. When I use the word context, I'm not simply talking about how someone meant something they wrote or said. Context is the circumstances that form the setting for an event, statement, or idea, and in terms of which it can be fully understood and assessed.

And how would arguing context prove to be favorable to Priefer? Can you give me some examples? Or would these examples simply come back to speculation and personal opinion? I just find context extremely hard to argue, let alone prove. That's where I'm at with it. Add in all of his lying and whatnot, it gets even harder. I think admitting wrongdoing and apologizing goes a long way. It doesn't appear that is how it went down, so no, I don't have much patience for this guy or this context argument. He should have told the truth a long time ago if he had nothing to hide.

[dead_poet]

And how would arguing context prove to be favorable to Priefer? Can you give me some examples? Or would these examples simply come back to speculation and personal opinion? I just find context extremely hard to argue, let alone prove. That's where I'm at with it. Add in all of his lying and whatnot, it gets even harder. I think admitting wrongdoing and apologizing goes a long way. It doesn't appear that is how it went down, so no, I don't have much patience for this guy or this context argument. He should have told the truth a long time ago if he had nothing to hide.

(just trying to ease the tension)

[Funkytown]

(just trying to ease the tension)

I'm as cool as a cucumber.

[Mothman]

(just trying to ease the tension)

I appreciate the effort but I'm done. I don't need the baiting and personal insults and I'm tired of trying to explain why things like facts, evidence and a better understanding of the actual circumstances in a case are important.

[Purple bruise]

I appreciate the effort but I'm done. I don't need the baiting and personal insults and I'm tired of trying to explain why things like facts, evidence and a better understanding of the actual circumstances in a case are important. [/quote][/quote]

Can't blame you Jim, this gets ridiculous

[King James]

When Kluwe was still a member of the Vikings I do remember hearing reports about how Priefer being frustrated with his performance. I think this was around the time that Kluwe kept speaking to the media, I think homosexuality was one of the things he talked about to the media. I remember it was supposed to be either Frazier or Priefer who told him to hold off on all the media attention. I think Priefer was mainly upset because Kluwe wasn't punting that good. And when people get upset, they often say crazy stuff. I hope Priefer didn't say it because I like his coaching. But Priefer DOES seem like he has the type of personality to say something like that out of anger. I'm not saying he did it or didn't. I'm neutral on the accusation now. Dont really know whose side to believe

[King James]

Indeed. I'll admit that if I was making $3 million dollars/year and my boss said what Priefer allegedly said, I'd probably be upset but wouldn't want to jeopardize my career.

So all that being said why is he suing? Is he suing for the justice of gay people or because he got fired? Had he still been here and Priefer made these comments would these discrimination against gays still matter? I mean I'm trying to understand the motive here. I'm feeling there's some spite he's feeling towards the team. He already disrespected them in the article by calling them names. Which leads me to believe this is personal resentment against the coaches and homosexuality is just used to get this story any attention. Even if Priefer did say what he said, I don't think Kluwe really cared. He's not gay so it doesn't affect him. It didn't affect his position on the depth chart during the season. I don't think it was out of fear of losing his job. I think he didn't come out until now is because he's gone and he seems to really hate Priefer and wants him to suffer some kind of punishment.

[Raptorman]

Bottom line. Kluwe wants the report made public. I think if the Vikings made the report public he would not sue. And if he does, he most likely will not win. Although the report may me damaging to the Vikings they will survive. The best thing the Vikings can do now is simple.

1. Release the report.
2. Have Priefer apologize for the remarks. (if he made them that is.)
3. Have some kind of counseling for Priefer and a penalty of some sort.
4. Put forth what they are doing to prevent this in the future.

While is seems ridiculous that the Vikings would have to do this, this would be the fastest and easiest way to make the issue go away. Once this is done, the issue will be gone with the first new arrest by any NFL player. And Kluwe can go on to other things that turn his fancy. Suing he Vikings for being cut is a suit he cannot win.

[dead_poet]

So all that being said why is he suing?

For their refusal to release the results of a six-month independent investigation into Kluwe's claims that special-teams coordinator Mike Priefer made homophobic remarks during the 2012 season and also for religious discrimination, sexual-orientation discrimination, defamation and "tortious interference with contractual relations" but it was said he would reconsider the suit if the Vikings release the report. His attorney said he had been working on the terms of a settlement agreement with the Vikings, which would have come in conjunction with the release of the report and would have required the team to donate $1 million to charities that support gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender causes.

Is he suing for the justice of gay people or because he got fired?

He's suing for the reasons listed above.

Had he still been here and Priefer made these comments would these discrimination against gays still matter?

I would think that discrimination matters regardless when or where it occurs. I'd wager Kluwe would agree.

I mean I'm trying to understand the motive here.

The motive is to get the Vikings to make the report public and proving him right in his claims.

I'm feeling there's some spite he's feeling towards the team.

Well, yeah. He feels as though he was let go because of things other than his performance. That's naturally going to cause spite and feelings of resentment.

homosexuality is just used to get this story any attention.

It's not being "used." Kluwe has the feeling that people of all sexualities should be treated equally and not be discriminated against. The comments that Priefer allegedly made were Kluwe found offensive. As Kluwe stated in his Deadspin letter: "It's my belief, based on everything that happened over the course of 2012, that I was fired by Mike Priefer, a bigot who didn't agree with the cause I was working for"

Even if Priefer did say what he said, I don't think Kluwe really cared. He's not gay so it doesn't affect him.

Please don't be that naive. People can be offended or take action on any issue or belief. There were thousands of Caucasian people that fought for Civil Rights and countless other examples throughout history of people standing up for what they believe in, even if they weren't the group being discriminated against or persecuted.

I think he didn't come out until now is because he's gone and he seems to really hate Priefer and wants him to suffer some kind of punishment.

Well, considering he said " Mike Priefer never holds a coaching position again in the NFL, and ideally never coaches at any level." that's a fairly safe assumption.

[dead_poet]

That's what I am saying the whole time. Teams don't like distractions regardless of what it is causing that distraction.

Yes, but you can't fire someone for having and expressing those beliefs.