Packers get hosed LMAO!

[Mothman]

Again ... I'm not saying anybody is wrong. Of course as a fan I would rather it not be true but I understand life doesn't always work out that way.

My only point is that you need hard evidence. It might seem obvious to you, but ever tried convincing a Packers fan that they get better calls on a regular basis? There has to be some kind of "bad call" tracking in place to prove what you're saying.

I would also like to see the number of "bad/questionable" overall calls last year as opposed to this year to give an indication of if the replacement refs are really doing worse or if now that fans are paying closer attention they're seeing all the cracks in calling games that already existed.

I have no doubt they're doing worse because it's not just the bad calls they're making that serve as an indication of the inferiority of the officiating, it's the calls they're missing and the lack of control over games. It's clear that some players and coaches are pushing boundaries and taking advantage of the replacement officials' inexperience.

[Cliff]

Well it is possible because I just listed some numbers for you.

What numbers did you give me? Four games is supposed to be evidence of a league-wide conspiracy?

[Crax]

There has to be some kind of "bad call" tracking in place to prove what you're saying.

Over the past few years, I've considered creating a website to attempt to track that. My original idea was for NBA games, but could be both. There is a few issues I could never sort out in my head though. I'd like to have users submit timestamps of said bad calls and or video clips. Ideally I would like to post bad calls and let people vote on all posted calls. Unfortunately, you'd get teams with huge fanbases like cowboys etc. being able to influence said voting.

Also, the only good possible way would be to post a video clip of said bad call. It would then just have to be text descriptions. NFL/NBA would never allow a non-approved source to post clips of their stuff criticizing their refs. I'd get DMCA takedowns right away. It would require hosting in another country and trying to get around copyright claims from the NFL.

[BGM]

Enough with the conspiracy that certain teams get calls for them, already.

If they do, so what? Have those calls led to those teams being dominant? Or winning more than a game or two, if even that? Seriously, the idea that a few botched calls a game equals some kind of league-wide agenda is laughable.

Listen, sometimes refs screw up and sometimes they are just useless, just like people in any other job. But I am confident that botched calls wash in the end.

I just hate to hear fellow Vikings fans saying stuff like that... makes us look like whiners.

[Hunter Morrow]

[Mothman]

McCarthy said. “I’ve never seen anything like that in all my years in football.”.

I'm not sure I have either. A lot of non-Packers fans, writers, broadcasters, etc. are saying the same thing today. I don't see how that comment makes McCarthy a crybaby but YMMV. It's certainly not worth debating. I just wondered what you heard that led you to make that remark.

[Hunter Morrow]

Never saw anything like that in his life? McCarthy saw the Packers ROB the Vikings on Sunday Night Football.

[Mothman]

Here's a link to the NFL's official response:

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/post/_ ... s-seahawks

Edit: Siefert also posted this:

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcnorth/post/_ ... re-of-same

The NFL affirmed the game's result is final. I didn't expect commissioner Roger Goodell to invoke his authority to overturn it based on the "Extraordinarily Unfair Acts" clause of its rule book, and I guess this muted response shouldn't be that surprising, either. I guess there's no turning back when your strategy is to fool people into accepting that a charade is somehow legitimate.

Well said! The whole blog post is worth reading.

[Hunter Morrow]

Admitting drive sustaining penalties and non-calls as well as a terrible, terrible pass inteference non-call and blown interception for the "dramatic upset" would have fans in an uproar and crying for the firing of these retardo-refs. It be full admission of guilt and bungling on the NFL. So of course they say that the game was professionally and accurately officiated last night and will probably fine the Packers a collective quarter mil over it all.

[The Breeze]

Wow! Just heard about this due to this thread. I watched this game until seattle failed on 4th and 3 from the packer four...then I left the sports bar. How could Green Bay not run out the clock?!

Too bad for packer fans... , but this is the worst call I've ever seen. Blatant push off and no possession. The regular refs have huge leverage now....the league needs to pays these guys and be done with this crap. What a joke! And the league released a statement that they stand behind the call...... AND THEY DRUG TEST PLAYERS? Somebody's high on something.....high on stupid. One month Goodell is promoting football at the Olympics and globally with huge dollar signs in his eyes, and in a matter of 3 short weeks they basically cut off their nose to spite their face.

ridiculous.....

[Cliff]

I hope the real refs come back soon. Then all of the blown calls that cost teams games can go back to being accepted as "part of the game" again.

Yeah ... this was a blown call. No, it shouldn't have happened. Is it really that rare?

Possible game changing bad calls in recent history;

Last years playoffs - http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... ts-fumble/

Saturday night’s game between the Lions and Saints included a bad call on an apparent fumble that could have allowed the Lions to seize a 21-7 lead late in the first half.

October of last season - http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... ree-yards/

The NFL has acknowledged that the 49ers’ game-winning drive in the fourth quarter in Detroit on Sunday was aided by the officials spotting the ball at the Lions’ 35-yard line to start the drive, when it should have been spotted at the 40.

Obviously, the mistake is inexcusable. And the officiating throughout this game was a mess.

September of last season - http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... was-legal/

It turns out it wasn’t illegal. The league admitted that the game official made an error, according to Marshall.

“NFL looked at my hit on cam newton from Sundays game and said it was legal. Happy to say I’m not getting fined, thanks,” Marshall tweeted.

Newton’s day wouldn’t have looked quite as spectacular if not for the error. The penalty wiped out an interception. A few plays later, Newton found Steve Smith for an 89-yard touchdown.

November 2010 - http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8 ... t-steelers

The NFL has informed the Pittsburgh Steelers that a pair of penalties that nearly cost them a win over the Cincinnati Bengals on Monday should not have been called in the first place, according to the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette.

Oct 2010 - http://nflspinzone.com/2010/10/25/steel ... gh-to-5-1/

Steelers vs. Dolphins: Blown Call Elevates Pittsburgh to 5-1

December 2011 - http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... ting-crew/

Complaining about the officiating crew after a loss is generally bad form by a head coach. But we can’t blame Redskins coach Mike Shanahan on Sunday.

It’s not the officiating was one sided. Jeff Triplette’s crew made shaky calls that hurt both teams, with two particularly bad roughing calls. (On London Fletcher and Vince Wilfork.)

Article covers 5 more bad calls from 2011 - http://www.footballnation.com/content/t ... 011/11828/

http://www.footballnation.com/content/t ... 011/11828/

Opening Thursday night game from 2011 - http://nflblowncalls.blogspot.com/2011/ ... rence.html


==========
Shall I keep going? This is the result of a 20 minute google search, spans only the first 3 pages of search results, and is only focusing on the 2010 & 2011 season. If I went back to 2009 I could have thrown in the non-call in the NFCC for good measure.

Until I see some kind of hard evidence that says otherwise, it's going to be tough for me to believe that the replacement refs are really doing *that* much of a worse job.

[Mothman]

Until I see some kind of hard evidence that says otherwise, it's going to be tough for me to believe that the replacement refs are really doing *that* much of a worse job.

Just watch the games, Cliff (if you have the time). It was particularly evident in the Sunday and Monday night games this week (which each had something like 24 called penalties). The officials barely had control of those games.

The frustration with the replacements isn't just over blown judgment calls. We all know officials are human beings and even the regular NFL crews make mistakes. However, the replacements have shown an inability to make calls with anywhere near the consistency that the "real" refs did, a failure to grasp even some of the basic rules, sloppy timekeeping, sloppy enforcement of yardage after penalties, etc. They're getting a lot of basic stuff wrong and the hard evidence is right there in the games. The 49ers were basically given 2 extra timeouts against the Vikings. Seattle was given an extra timeout against Arizona. Last night's final call came after a game full of poor officiating and blown calls and again, it showed a fundamental misunderstanding of the rules and how the officials are supposed to handle that kind of situation.

It's a mess.

[VikingLord]

Until I see some kind of hard evidence that says otherwise, it's going to be tough for me to believe that the replacement refs are really doing *that* much of a worse job.

In regards to the Packer-Seahawk game last night, the really sad part is that if Jennings had played to knock the ball down instead of intercept it the refs never would have been involved (save, perhaps, to call the offensive PI on Tate). In that sense the loss was deserved, because by not playing fundamentally sound Jennings created a situation where the outcome could be decided by the refs. He's in heavy traffic late in a game. All the Packers need to do is get off the field. They don't need another drive, field position, or anything. There is *nothing* other than padding his stats that Jennings can accomplish by going for the pick in that situation.

This is similar to what happened to Jared Allen against the Colts when he was flagged for hitting Luck out of bounds. I still Allen wanted that sack and as a result he created a situation where the ref could get involved.

Got to always play for the team first. If the stats come, they come, but players who go off script in search of personal glory deserve what they get IMHO. I saw too much of that with the late '80's Vikings and I hate to see that type of play because it costs the team.

[S197]

Is this a joke post? you do realize the bad calls have gone in the Packers favor 99% of the time for at least 3 years right? That's why Packer fans are so outraged because they've never had a call work against them!

Breathe.

Right after the Vikings game there was a back and forth in one of these threads about how certain teams receiver preferential treatment, including the Packers. I just found it ironic that hours later the Packers were screwed by the refs.

[Cliff]

Just watch the games, Cliff (if you have the time). It was particularly evident in the Sunday and Monday night games this week (which each had something like 24 called penalties). The officials barely had control of those games.

The frustration with the replacements isn't just over blown judgment calls. We all know officials are human beings and even the regular NFL crews make mistakes. However, the replacements have shown an inability to make calls with anywhere near the consistency that the "real" refs did, a failure to grasp even some of the basic rules, sloppy timekeeping, sloppy enforcement of yardage after penalties, etc. They're getting a lot of basic stuff wrong and the hard evidence is right there in the games. The 49ers were basically given 2 extra timeouts against the Vikings. Seattle was given an extra timeout against Arizona. Last night's final call came after a game full of poor officiating and blown calls and again, it showed a fundamental misunderstanding of the rules and how the officials are supposed to handle that kind of situation.

It's a mess.

Actually this season I have been watching more football than most years because I got NFL Sunday Ticket for the first time(though last Vikings game I was with my wife watching Wicked).

I will definitely grant you that they have missed some run-of-the-mill stuff ... though even something like the extra time out happened as recently as 2009. I realize there were only 2 instance of that before this season, but part of that is because the challenge rules haven't been in effect for very long.

In my years of watching football the refs have always seemed inconsistant to me. They've blown big calls even after instant replay seems to prove otherwise, they've made phantom calls that didn't seem to actually happen, they've completely missed calls that happened right in front of them. It's the same every season.

It's just going to take more than "watch the games!" for me to change my opinion on this as I really can't tell much of a difference and I have been watching. It just seems like the media attention to the replacement refs is fueling this more than the refs themselves. As I've already pointed out, as recently as last season refs made bad calls that determined the outcome of multiple games. I also recall many "non-calls" and that was just with the Vikings games I got to watch last season.

The replacement refs lack of experience alone puts them at a disadvantage when compared to the regular refs. However, for me, if the regular refs are a 5 out of 10 then the replacement refs are a 4 out of 10 from my view. Yeah, they're not quite as good but the old refs were so horrible to begin with I don't see a huge difference.

All that said, I would like for NFL officiating to improve ... I just feel like it already needed to.