Christian Ponder Improving

[yesmanfan]

for what its worth, i don't think a single nfl team would sign jenkins if he were released tomorrow. as far as burton goes, i think that is all i need to say.

maybe about jenkins, but he is a great blocker, has been very solid this year, and has had 8 big receptions for 88 yards. also, he was a calming influence on the sideline and in the huddle on the 14 sec drive and was telling everyone we can do this, "ive been part of a drive just like this before."

i left burton off the list on purpose.

[FailedtoOpen]

He seems very conservative with the ball. Whether that's from having meh receivers again, or just being unwilling to create too many turnovers I dunno.

[S197]

I know in other discussions such as with schemes it's often brought up that what, if we were the coach, would we do differently. With Ponder, one of the things I'd like for him to work on is the pump fake. He's likely going to continue to throw these quick, short route passes, throw in a double move by the WR, pump fake and make the DB bite, and hit the WR at the second or third level. All great QB's utilize this to freeze defenses and frankly I can't remember the last time I've seen Ponder utilize it.

[Crax]

With Ponder, one of the things I'd like for him to work on is the pump fake. He's likely going to continue to throw these quick, short route passes, throw in a double move by the WR, pump fake and make the DB bite, and hit the WR at the second or third level. All great QB's utilize this to freeze defenses and frankly I can't remember the last time I've seen Ponder utilize it.

I can't recall seeing it this year either. I think the pump fake could be utilized more as well.

[VikingLord]

I just don't know if throwing early and often with the pieces we have is going to produce better results. I'd love for them to try it, though, but I understand why it's not to this point. I maintain that our ground game remains superior to our passing game, so it only makes sense to continue to play to your strengths. Maybe I'm wrong and other teams shift away from what they do best. Or maybe what we do best isn't the run game? I'm probably wrong.

I think the main point of attempting some mid and deep-range passes is to let the defense know you're willing to try it and they have to play honest against it. Even if it doesn't result in big gainers, it does send that message and, as a result, keeps the defense from crashing forward.

Based on what I've seen, the Vikings rushing attack is relatively weak right now. In terms of league averages, they're in the middle of the pack (15th in YPA). The blocking is still spotty, AD lacks his explosiveness, which is understandable, but a liability if you're hoping for big-hitters from the running game, and in general the offensive strategy remains very predictable.

Not without some irony, their next opponent currently ranks 2nd in the league in terms of rushing YPA. It's not a small gap, either. San Fran gets 5.7 YPA, while the Vikings clock in at 4.0.

[Cliff]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap100000 ... ent_stream

Christian Ponder leads NFL in completion percentage

It's a small sample size, but Ponder's completed 47 of 62 passes for 515 yards, with two touchdowns and no picks. He's been aided by the hot hand of Percy Harvin, who's pulled in 18 of 21 passes thrown his way, but Ponder's also spread the ball around to eight different targets during the team's 1-1 start.

I have a feeling that might change after this weeks game against the 49ers.

I know he has a lot of shorter targets, these stats are against two questionable (at best) teams, etc ... still ... not bad.

[60niners]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap100000 ... ent_stream

Christian Ponder leads NFL in completion percentage
I have a feeling that might change after this weeks game against the 49ers.

I know he has a lot of shorter targets, these stats are against two questionable (at best) teams, etc ... still ... not bad.

Those stats should be very encouraging! Alex Smith is being praised pretty heavily right now and his stats are slightly less impressive.

[Demi]

I have a feeling Smith's stats are actually coming from hitting his receivers down field. Not throwing a 0 yard pass and the receiver picking up thirty yards.

[Raptorman]

I have a feeling Smith's stats are actually coming from hitting his receivers down field. Not throwing a 0 yard pass and the receiver picking up thirty yards.

Actually, he only has 5 passes that went for more than 20 yards. Same as Ponder.

[mosscarter]

demi: how about the fact that smith has actual receivers to throw the ball to, shouldn't that play some sort of factor in the discussion? one would think, but then again, who knows after reading some of these posts. our receivers are deplorable aside from harvin.

[psjordan]

...our receivers are deplorable aside from harvin.

Why do people keep posting this? What tangible proof is there? We rank 21st (lower the better) in dropped passes. Extrapolation for this season gives you:
P. Harvin, 144 catches for 1504 yds
M. Jenkins, 64 for 704
K. Rudolph, 64 for 816
D. Aromashodu, 32 for 640
Why are our receivers disparaged so much? They don't get open? Could be 80% Ponder's fault. They don't catch enough balls? Could be Ponder and coaching. They don't catch long balls or TD balls? Ponder and coaching could be huge reasons.

I have to say that just watching Ponder as passing plays progress gives me the heebie geebies. Yes he has a decent arm, but I really think the "rest of the package" is a long ways off. I absolutely think he and the coaches changed his footwork and timing mechanics this offseason. Similar to a new golf swing, I don't know how long before (or if) it pays off.

At this point I would be about 50/50 if the overall passing game issue is that our receivers do not get open or that Ponder is off on his vision or timing. I certainly can't lay it all at the feet of our receivers at this point.

[dead_poet]

Why do people keep posting this?

Because the guys we have starting outside of Harvin would be #3 or #4 receivers at best on the majority of NFL rosters and there's a good chance if released today Burton and Aromashodu (and possibly even Jenkins) probably wouldn't even be added to anyone's 53? You forgot to extrapolate Burton.

[Mothman]

Because the guys we have starting outside of Harvin would be #3 or #4 receivers at best on the majority of NFL rosters and there's a good chance if released today Burton and Aromashodu (and possibly even Jenkins) probably wouldn't even be added to anyone's 53? You forgot to extrapolate Burton.

Plus there are numerous reports from people who cover the Vikings that discuss the inability of Vikings receivers not named Harvin to get open.

At this point, however, it wouldn't surprise me if Ponder and Musgrave were held responsible for global warming.

Jim

[psjordan]

Plus there are numerous reports from people who cover the Vikings that discuss the inability of Vikings receivers not named Harvin to get open.

At this point, however, it wouldn't surprise me if Ponder and Musgrave were held responsible for global warming.

Jim

Please. We are down to silly rhetoric?

I know everyone likes to harp on Ponder's "awesome" stats, but I find it hard to believe how many will put the woes of the passing game solely at the feet of our receivers - assuming of course they have watched the games at all (and being a newcomer to Sunday Ticket, I have watched every wretched minute).

If we have three receivers that catch 230 passes this year (the entire TEAM only caught 286 last year), as they are on track to do, are you seriously going to state the 100 completed to two guys not named Harvin were to "covered" guys and Ponder simply pinpointed it in there after a wicked call by Musgrave? And not a soul can be patient until Simpson arrives?

As with all things NFL, the "blame" for poor performance is rarely justified to be aimed at one target.

[dead_poet]

I know everyone likes to harp on Ponder's "awesome" stats, but I find it hard to believe how many will put the woes of the passing game solely at the feet of our receivers

I don't think anyone is placing blame solely on the feet of our receivers. I'm sure there are instances Ponder missed open receivers (all QBs do for one reason or another) or could've attempted deeper passes to guys and had them fight to make a play. However it's been pretty clear he and the coaching staff want to minimize mistakes (and not throw to covered guys because, unlike Rice, they haven't consistently shown they can win a one-on-one). Instead, he's managing the game efficiently the way it's being called. Again, it's not as if he's constantly checking down. The routes are designed shorter to Harvin as typically the primary read even though most every play has a deeper option.

If we have three receivers that catch 230 passes this year (the entire TEAM only caught 286 last year), as they are on track to do, are you seriously going to state the 100 completed to two guys not named Harvin were to "covered" guys and Ponder simply pinpointed it in there after a wicked call by Musgrave? And not a soul can be patient until Simpson arrives?

It's a little premature to extrapolate anything from only two games when we're missing a key starter. But I see your point. I think.

As with all things NFL, the "blame" for poor performance is rarely justified to be aimed at one target.

I agree. Although, to this point, Ponder's performance (especially in the second half of games) has been pretty solid and he's doing what he's been asked to do from my vantage point. His protection past his first read (or two) and receivers' abilities to separate have been brought into question by many and I think have contributed to focusing on shorter passes (which also allow Harvin to do his thing).