Next years QB

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Pondering Her Percy
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Re: Next years QB

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

PurpleKoolaid wrote:Not sure how to post multiple posts PHP, but I started believing in Rick when he picked Elfein. He was the one lineman I wanted so bad, simply a beast, and I couldnt believe Rick picked an Oline guy that early. Also my #1 player I wanted was Cook. I was so afraid we would take that pos Mixon, who I make a point never to even read his stats.

Right now rick has put a team together with some depth. Hes also made mistakes, but some of the ones hes made were understandable. I would love it if we could somehow get a 4th for Treadwell. Make Rick can make something happen. I really believe Rick will draft a very good lineman, a good DT, and a decent QB. And then maybe another project Oline guy. Should be extremely interesting. I just hope we dont trade any players or future draft picks. its take a long time to get to this point. We also need to find out why Zimmers D (and Offense I guess) lays such a big fat effing egg sometimes. Games everyone knew were over by the time the second half started.
:shock: I’m blown away! PK has confidence in Rick Spielman?! I don’t think there is one person on this board I’ve battled more with over Spielman than you. Maybe Demi but he retired from the board when the Vikings got good again lol. Well I’m glad Rick has finally made you a believer. :smilevike:
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Re: Next years QB

Post by PurpleMustReign »

I actually forgot about Demi. I winder where he is?

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Re: Next years QB

Post by Slick Rick »

Pondering Her Percy wrote:Bridgewater's "game" so far has been average at best. I think that is pretty obvious. So I'm not sure what there is to argue there. He's thrown 28 TDs to 21 INTs in his first two years. It's not like he was some elite QB before this injury. He's as big of a gamble as they come right now. And don't bother using Peyton Manning and Brett Favre. Saying "well they werent that great their first couple years and then they became great". Its nothing but speculation. You're saying Teddy's got "game". I don't know what that means because IMO, 28 TDs and 21 INTs is average as it gets. I mean to throw 14 TDs in your second year as a starter in the same offense with an elite RB behind you isn't good. He was averaging 200 yards a game in his SECOND YEAR. 24 yards less than his first year. I'm not sure where you're getting your stats from. Blame the OL, blame whoever but bottom line is, thats not good.
14 TDs to 10 INTs also isn't anywhere close to bad, and considering the fact that he actually cut down on INTs from 12 to 9 in his second year, he was trending in the positive direction. For a kid in his early 20s to go 14 and 12 followed by 14 and 9, with ~3,000 yards in each season and a 65% completion rate, that's pretty damn impressive especially when you consider that he took us to the playoffs and won the division in only his second year (and most recent year) of starting. He was definitely better than average, unless you think the average QB is capable of a QB rating in the high 80s. When I think of average, I think of Christian Ponder circa 2012 and definitely not Teddy Bridgewater being efficient.
Dude again, where are you getting your stats from?? The stats support it?? Ok. Well Kirk Cousins was sacked 41 times this year. 41!!!! That is more than Sam Bradford did in 2016 behind one of the worst OL us Vikings fans have ever seen. And Cousins is a lot more mobile than Bradford is. You say Teddy's OL was SO bad and he was sacked 44 times. But Cousins was sacked 41 times this year and his line was good? :lol:
What's funny is that you use sacks as a measurement of what makes a good offensive line, there are guys on PFF who know how to crunch statistics and who've made much better rating systems for us that take things like, oh I don't know, the quality of pass rushers faced, the mobility of the QB, etc. I can even explain them in a little bit more detail if you'd like. :)
He "has the game"? Again, how and where do you see that?? What stats "definitely back that up"? If you want to use stats, you're beat.

Cousins TD:INT ratio is nearly 2.5 to 1. Teddy's is nearly 1 to 1.
Cousins has broke 4,000 yards the last 3 years and one year was 83 yards shy of breaking 5,000. Teddy hasnt broke 3,300.
Cousins completion percentage averages a little over 67%. Teddy is about 64.8%.
Cousins yards per completion is 7.8. Teddys is 7.25.
Cousins averages 59 20+ yard passes per year. Teddy averages about 40.
Cousins averages 10 40+ yard passes per year. Teddy averages 6.5
Cousins has had very weak defenses. Teddy's were in the top half of the league every year.
Cousins has had very weak RBs. Teddy had one of the best ever in 2015 and he still had many underwhelming performances that year.

Cousins crushes him in every statistical category pretty much. Teddy's stats work against you in an argument like this. They are average to even below average. Kirk Cousins has been very consistent over the last 3 years. He also has never had a major injury. The two aren't even close to being comparable.
You're right, Cousins has had a better career than Teddy, but I'm still wondering where you're getting that I'm comparing the two. :lol:
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Re: Next years QB

Post by S197 »

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
mosscarter wrote:I'm right with you pondering: anyone but Teddy.
Like I said if we keep him and keep Case. I’m all for it. Because we can see what Teddy has in the preseason and maybe compete with case but to just go all in with Teddy and maybe a rookie is asinine IMO. Way too risky. We have a SB roster. Were THIS close. It’s cousins or Case. Gotta be
I'm of similar opinion, if Teddy comes back he needs to come with or as a Case contingency. We simply can't risk such an important position on a potential Greg Childs 2.0. Teddy has some great intangibles but the risk is so high it simply can't be ignored even if it sounds harsh.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

Slick Rick wrote:
14 TDs to 10 INTs also isn't anywhere close to bad, and considering the fact that he actually cut down on INTs from 12 to 9 in his second year, he was trending in the positive direction. For a kid in his early 20s to go 14 and 12 followed by 14 and 9, with ~3,000 yards in each season and a 65% completion rate, that's pretty damn impressive especially when you consider that he took us to the playoffs and won the division in only his second year (and most recent year) of starting. He was definitely better than average, unless you think the average QB is capable of a QB rating in the high 80s. When I think of average, I think of Christian Ponder circa 2012 and definitely not Teddy Bridgewater being efficient.
:lol: dude you got it all wrong. You really think Ponder was average?!!! He was downright bad.....bad. You really think 14:10 is good or even average? It hovers average to below average dude. Derek Carr threw for 21 tds his first year with less ints than Teddy and followed it up with THIRTY TWO his second year. That’s over 2 times than what Teddy did and he made the playoffs but sadly, didn’t have near the talent Teddy had. Oakland’s d was horrendous. And he didn’t have Adrian Peterson behind him.
What's funny is that you use sacks as a measurement of what makes a good offensive line, there are guys on PFF who know how to crunch statistics and who've made much better rating systems for us that take things like, oh I don't know, the quality of pass rushers faced, the mobility of the QB, etc. I can even explain them in a little bit more detail if you'd like. :)
Dude come on seriously? Are you that oblivious to how bad Washington’s OL was? You clearly don’t watch football enough to know that their OL was pathetic this year. TJ Clemmings started games? Shall I say more? I could give two craps what PFF says. Cousins was sacked 41 times!! Bradford was sacked 37 and couldn’t scramble from pressure in 2016 to Dave his life . But yeah Kirk had a good OL!! :lol: I don’t care if he faced JJ Watt every game. That line was TERRIBLE


You're right, Cousins has had a better career than Teddy, but I'm still wondering where you're getting that I'm comparing the two. :lol:
I’m not saying you are but the difference between the two are gigantic. Your best bet is to stop making excuses for a guy that’s proved nothing in this league and hasn’t played in two years and watch some more football. Teddy Bridgewater does NOT deserve to be a starter for not only the Vikings but any team this year. Until he proves himself he should be a backup until further notice
Last edited by Pondering Her Percy on Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

S197 wrote:
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
mosscarter wrote:I'm right with you pondering: anyone but Teddy.
Like I said if we keep him and keep Case. I’m all for it. Because we can see what Teddy has in the preseason and maybe compete with case but to just go all in with Teddy and maybe a rookie is asinine IMO. Way too risky. We have a SB roster. Were THIS close. It’s cousins or Case. Gotta be
I'm of similar opinion, if Teddy comes back he needs to come with or as a Case contingency. We simply can't risk such an important position on a potential Greg Childs 2.0. Teddy has some great intangibles but the risk is so high it simply can't be ignored even if it sounds harsh.
Bingo!!
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Re: Next years QB

Post by PurpleMustReign »

Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Slick Rick wrote:
14 TDs to 10 INTs also isn't anywhere close to bad, and considering the fact that he actually cut down on INTs from 12 to 9 in his second year, he was trending in the positive direction. For a kid in his early 20s to go 14 and 12 followed by 14 and 9, with ~3,000 yards in each season and a 65% completion rate, that's pretty damn impressive especially when you consider that he took us to the playoffs and won the division in only his second year (and most recent year) of starting. He was definitely better than average, unless you think the average QB is capable of a QB rating in the high 80s. When I think of average, I think of Christian Ponder circa 2012 and definitely not Teddy Bridgewater being efficient.
[emoji38] dude you got it all wrong. You really think Ponder was average?!!! He was downright bad.....bad. You really think 14:10 is good or even average? It hovers average to below average dude. Derek Carr threw for 21 tds his first year with less ints than Teddy and followed it up with THIRTY TWO his second year. That’s over 2 times than what Teddy did and he made the playoffs but sadly, didn’t have near the talent Teddy had. Oakland’s d was horrendous. And he didn’t have Adrian Peterson behind him.
What's funny is that you use sacks as a measurement of what makes a good offensive line, there are guys on PFF who know how to crunch statistics and who've made much better rating systems for us that take things like, oh I don't know, the quality of pass rushers faced, the mobility of the QB, etc. I can even explain them in a little bit more detail if you'd like. :)
Dude come on seriously? Are you that oblivious to how bad Washington’s OL was? You clearly don’t watch football enough to know that their OL was pathetic this year. TJ Clemmings started games? Shall I say more? I could give two craps what PFF says. Cousins was sacked 41 times!! Bradford was sacked 37 and couldn’t scramble from pressure in 2016 to Dave his life . But yeah Kirk had a good OL!! [emoji38] I don’t care if he faced JJ Watt every game. That line was TERRIBLE


You're right, Cousins has had a better career than Teddy, but I'm still wondering where you're getting that I'm comparing the two. [emoji38]
I’m not saying you are but the difference between the two are gigantic. Your best bet is to stop making excuses for a guy that’s proved nothing in this league and hasn’t played in two years and watch some more football. Teddy Bridgewater does NOT deserve to be a starter for not only the Vikings but any team this year. Until he proves himself he should be a backup until further notice
This post is why people don't like posting with you. Just give your points without calling the other person "wrong" or stupid or anything. Even I get uncomfortable reading some of your responses sometimes.

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Re: Next years QB

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

PurpleMustReign wrote:
Pondering Her Percy wrote:
Slick Rick wrote:
14 TDs to 10 INTs also isn't anywhere close to bad, and considering the fact that he actually cut down on INTs from 12 to 9 in his second year, he was trending in the positive direction. For a kid in his early 20s to go 14 and 12 followed by 14 and 9, with ~3,000 yards in each season and a 65% completion rate, that's pretty damn impressive especially when you consider that he took us to the playoffs and won the division in only his second year (and most recent year) of starting. He was definitely better than average, unless you think the average QB is capable of a QB rating in the high 80s. When I think of average, I think of Christian Ponder circa 2012 and definitely not Teddy Bridgewater being efficient.
[emoji38] dude you got it all wrong. You really think Ponder was average?!!! He was downright bad.....bad. You really think 14:10 is good or even average? It hovers average to below average dude. Derek Carr threw for 21 tds his first year with less ints than Teddy and followed it up with THIRTY TWO his second year. That’s over 2 times than what Teddy did and he made the playoffs but sadly, didn’t have near the talent Teddy had. Oakland’s d was horrendous. And he didn’t have Adrian Peterson behind him.
What's funny is that you use sacks as a measurement of what makes a good offensive line, there are guys on PFF who know how to crunch statistics and who've made much better rating systems for us that take things like, oh I don't know, the quality of pass rushers faced, the mobility of the QB, etc. I can even explain them in a little bit more detail if you'd like. :)
Dude come on seriously? Are you that oblivious to how bad Washington’s OL was? You clearly don’t watch football enough to know that their OL was pathetic this year. TJ Clemmings started games? Shall I say more? I could give two craps what PFF says. Cousins was sacked 41 times!! Bradford was sacked 37 and couldn’t scramble from pressure in 2016 to Dave his life . But yeah Kirk had a good OL!! [emoji38] I don’t care if he faced JJ Watt every game. That line was TERRIBLE


You're right, Cousins has had a better career than Teddy, but I'm still wondering where you're getting that I'm comparing the two. [emoji38]
I’m not saying you are but the difference between the two are gigantic. Your best bet is to stop making excuses for a guy that’s proved nothing in this league and hasn’t played in two years and watch some more football. Teddy Bridgewater does NOT deserve to be a starter for not only the Vikings but any team this year. Until he proves himself he should be a backup until further notice
This post is why people don't like posting with you. Just give your points without calling the other person "wrong" or stupid or anything. Even I get uncomfortable reading some of your responses sometimes.

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Because I said “dude you got it all wrong”? That makes you feel uncomfortable? Didn’t call anyone stupid either. Yet we just had guys on here calling other posters “stupid” and not a word was said to them. But I say “dude you got it all wrong” and go into explaining myself and that makes you uncomfortable?? Only in today’s world :confused:

But hey I guess Christian ponder is an average qb and we aren’t allowed to say if that is right or wrong.....
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Re: Next years QB

Post by dbqviking1 »

I honestly believe Spielman is gonna trade for Nick Foles. I think this may me the best QB move in my opinion. :rock:
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Re: Next years QB

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

dbqviking1 wrote:I honestly believe Spielman is gonna trade for Nick Foles. I think this may me the best QB move in my opinion. :rock:
No thanks. And I don’t understand why that would be the best move? He’s a middling QB and we’d have to give up picks. No less he’ll want a new contract
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Re: Next years QB

Post by mosscarter »

Maybe Bradford isn't as out of this equation as it is being made out in the news. The new OC said that Bradford was the best "pure passer he ever coached." If his knee is healthy, I'm starting to think they would rather throw 18-20 mil a year Bradford's way rather than Keenums.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by 808vikingsfan »

Pondering Her Percy wrote:My opinion? Ok. Well please enlighten me how Bridgewater has PROVED he can be a LEGIT QB?
Teddy should be a last resort option IMO right now. I’d take Cousins, Case and Sam all over him. I’d even consider taking McCarron. A few fans on here have gone to bat for Teddy but I’ve yet to see one fan give me a valid reason on how anyone could think he could be a legit QB for us. Especially after a bad injury. And until someone brings that to the table, my opinion regarding him being our 2018 starter will not change. It’s a gigantic risk and a stupid one with as good as this team is. We have so many other options that are much better QBs

Again it just baffles me with how critical some fans on this board are of Waynes, Barr, Murray, etc but back up a guy that’s done next to nothing in this league and hasn’t played in two years. It truly makes zero sense how anyone could have any kind of confidence in him right now. No less he wasn’t even good before he was injured. He was average. I wanna win a Super Bowl. Not watch Teddy throw for 150 yards 0 tds and 1 INT. No less it’s going to put more pressure on Cook and this defense. Keep him and case? Sure. But not just him to be a starter
Just posted why I believe Teddy's stats are deflated while Cousins are inflated. Your response to that? Nothing. Posted a link comparing 4th qtr stats between Cousins and Bridgewater. Again, your response? Nothing.

Don't bother replying. I just wanted to point that out.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by Pondering Her Percy »

808vikingsfan wrote:
Pondering Her Percy wrote:My opinion? Ok. Well please enlighten me how Bridgewater has PROVED he can be a LEGIT QB?
Teddy should be a last resort option IMO right now. I’d take Cousins, Case and Sam all over him. I’d even consider taking McCarron. A few fans on here have gone to bat for Teddy but I’ve yet to see one fan give me a valid reason on how anyone could think he could be a legit QB for us. Especially after a bad injury. And until someone brings that to the table, my opinion regarding him being our 2018 starter will not change. It’s a gigantic risk and a stupid one with as good as this team is. We have so many other options that are much better QBs

Again it just baffles me with how critical some fans on this board are of Waynes, Barr, Murray, etc but back up a guy that’s done next to nothing in this league and hasn’t played in two years. It truly makes zero sense how anyone could have any kind of confidence in him right now. No less he wasn’t even good before he was injured. He was average. I wanna win a Super Bowl. Not watch Teddy throw for 150 yards 0 tds and 1 INT. No less it’s going to put more pressure on Cook and this defense. Keep him and case? Sure. But not just him to be a starter
Just posted why I believe Teddy's stats are deflated while Cousins are inflated. Your response to that? Nothing. Posted a link comparing 4th qtr stats between Cousins and Bridgewater. Again, your response? Nothing.

Don't bother replying. I just wanted to point that out.
I mean I don’t need you to tell me what I should and shouldn’t respond to. I could care less what their 4th quarter stats were. Cousins is one of the better passers in the nfl no matter what way you look at it. What makes Teddy a legit QB? Some fans are so quick to defend him but back it up with next to nothing. He’s proved nothing. He’s had talent around him and has been average at best. Average! Until he proves other wise, he’ll always be an average at best QB IMO. I don’t want average. I want legit
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Re: Next years QB

Post by mosscarter »

Statistics are just statistics and in the end, can be bent to support whatever narrative a person wants. How else do you explain our defense this year? How, statistically speaking, would the number 1 ranked defense give up 38 unanswered points? Teddy Bridgewaters number not only suck, but he sucks overall as well. He has a weak arm, mild mobility, and now coming off a severe knee injury? He is clearly the worst choice of the three, and I honestly hope he is not in a Vikings uniform next year. If he is, oh well there is obviously nothing I can do about it but don't compare him to a Cousins or Bradford. I mean, at least least get serious with that. He threw for what was it, 18 or 19 TD's with a 1,500 yard runner in the backfield. I could put up those type of numbers, its pathetic.
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Re: Next years QB

Post by ocampo82 »

mosscarter wrote:Statistics are just statistics and in the end, can be bent to support whatever narrative a person wants. How else do you explain our defense this year? How, statistically speaking, would the number 1 ranked defense give up 38 unanswered points? Teddy Bridgewaters number not only suck, but he sucks overall as well. He has a weak arm, mild mobility, and now coming off a severe knee injury? He is clearly the worst choice of the three, and I honestly hope he is not in a Vikings uniform next year. If he is, oh well there is obviously nothing I can do about it but don't compare him to a Cousins or Bradford. I mean, at least least get serious with that. He threw for what was it, 18 or 19 TD's with a 1,500 yard runner in the backfield. I could put up those type of numbers, its pathetic.

It is a matter of perference/opinion, of course, but I think the same about Keenum "...weak arm, mild mobility..." and the other option--Bradford--coming off another knee injury. I would like to clean the deck of these three, but if Cousins isnt coming I say we pick which ever comes cheapest as they are all significantly flawed.

If that is Teddy, fine. When he played the team rallied around him more so than any Viking QB...since Farve? Sure his body of work is small, but in context he played with an offense in flux (Norv, AD, bad o-line) whereas Bradford and Keenum had some continutity with Shurmur, a solid 2017 oline, solid weapons.

I didn't look up the stats, but from memory the main knock I had with Teddy is the offense wasn't good in the red zone. With new coaching, personnel I hope that would be better if he is the QB.
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